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Deep Waters 'Deep Calleth Unto Deep ' -The place to go for Ministry discussions. Please keep it civil. Remember to discuss the issues, not each other.


 
 
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Old 05-09-2007, 01:01 PM
Praxeas's Avatar
Praxeas Praxeas is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2007
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It was 120 that spoke in tongues and I had this saved too!

120 people initially received the Spirit and spoke in tongues. This number included women

1)Evidence for the 120

The bible tells us 120 continued TOGETHER in prayer and supplication in the upper room
Act 1:13 And when they were come in, they went up into an upper room, where abode both Peter, and James, and John, and Andrew, Philip, and Thomas, Bartholomew, and Matthew, James the son of Alphaeus, and Simon Zelotes, and Judas the brother of James.
Act
1:14 These all continued with one accord in prayer and supplication, with the women, and Mary the mother of Jesus, and with his brethren.
Act 1:15 And in those days Peter stood up in the midst of the disciples, and said, (the number of names together were about an hundred and twenty,)

POINT: Notice the number, about 120 could be more, could be less, but close enough to that number.
POINT: ?and said? This shows that the following words by Peter were said WHILE standing up in the midst of 120 or so disciples, not 11 Apostles.
POINT: Notice they CONTINUED in ONE ACCORD in prayer
Read the continuing verses and there is absolutly NO indication of a dispersal. There is no switch in subject, which are the 120 Disciples continuing together.


2)Acts
1:16-22 Shows what Peter said while standing in the midst of 120 disciples. His speech was about the 11

Apostles and the need to replace one, this is proven by the triple use of the pronoun ?us?. So the audience was the 120 (included the 11), the subject was the 11 and the need to replace Judas.
Acts
1:23 And they appointed two, Joseph called Barsabas, who was surnamed Justus, and Matthias.


POINT: this shows two additional MEN, who were NOT Apostles that must have been in that group of 120 in order to be CHOSEN to replace Judas. This is additional evidence that there were more than the 11 and that the Apostles were NOT the only ones that were there but were the subject being discussed.

POINT: Since the subject of discussion was the 11 there is no way of knowing whether it was only the 11 who chose these men or the collective who chose these men.


3) Acts
1:26 And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and he was numbered with the eleven apostles.


POINT: The context shows Peter was speaking to a collective group of disciples numbering at least 120, including women. The context shows the subject of the speech was the 11 Apostles and who should replace Judas. The context shows finally how they chose to replace him. Therefore verse 26 shows us NOT who was present only, but the result of Peter's speech and their actions.

POINT: Only a careless reading of this verse would lead one to conclude this was the number of all present. Notice it does not say ?the number of men present was 11? but rather the author is telling us who the new Apostle was and that he was added to the remaining number of Apostles. The grammar here in no way tells us the number of who was present only but the result of the vote to replace Judas!

4) Act 2:1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.

POINT: Notice the word THEY. If you read back through Acts chapter 1 you will see THEY can only refer to the collection of Disciples numbering 120. POINT: Notice next the same context as in chapter 1, they were in ONE ACCORD. Those gathered with Peter and the Apostles were also in ONE ACCORD.
POINT: There is no indication the 11 separated from the rest of the collective. There is no grammatical break indicating anything changed. Men later added the chapters and verses, so a new chapter does not mean anything changed.
POINT: The chronologically, from the meeting with Peter and the 120 the next thing to happen is the outpouring of the Spirit. There is NO OTHER event stated in between so grammatically ?they? MUST refer to the antecedent group present in one accord.
POINT: There is NO given number of days between the meeting of 120 to decide on a new Apostle and the events of Pentecost. Nor would it matter. There is no stated rule that says the more days that there are the more disciples would not be present later on. That is fanciful thinking on someone?s part.
POINT: Luke tells the story where Jesus told the 11 and an unspecified number of disciples to go to
Jerusalem and wait for the Holy Spirit.

Luke continues Acts from what he wrote in Luke

Luk 24:33 And they rose up the same hour, and returned to
Jerusalem, and found the eleven gathered together, and them that were with them,

POINT: Acts is a continuation of Luke, the accounts are parallel. Notice the 11 AND them WITH them?? Notice also they were ALL already in
Jerusalem together? The number of disciples in Acts tells us the number in Luke

Luke 24:36-51 shows Jesus appearing, teaching the 11 plus the disciples with them about himself, instructed them to go to Jerusalem and preach repentance and remission of sins and promised them He would send the Holy Spirit ON THEM (not just some of them)

Luk 24:47 and repentance for the forgiveness of sins would be proclaimed in his name to all nations, beginning from Jerusalem.
Luk 24:48 You are witnesses of these things.
Luk 24:49 And look, I am sending you what my Father promised. But stay in the city until you have been clothed with power from on high."

THEN we have this startling account by Luke concerning those disciples, (which were the 11 plus those with them) who had been led out to Bethany by Jesus and returned to Jerusalem

Luk 24:52 And they worshipped him, and returned to Jerusalem with great joy:
Luk 24:53 And were continually in the temple, praising and blessing God. Amen.

POINT: They refers back to the 11 plus those WITH them. They were continually together praising and blessing God. This is paralleled in Acts chapter 1...compare Lukes account in the gospel with Lukes account in Acts 1

Act 1:4 While he was with them, he declared, "Do not leave
Jerusalem, but wait there for what my Father promised, which you heard about from me.
This was instructed, according to Luke to the 11 AND those with the 11. Luke tells us the NUMBER that were WITH the 11 in Acts 1

Act 1:13 When they had entered
Jerusalem, they went to the upstairs room where they were staying. Peter and John, and James, and Andrew, Philip and Thomas, Bartholomew and Matthew, James son of Alphaeus and Simon the Zealot, and Judas son of James were there.
Act
1:14 All these continued together in prayer with one mind, together with the women, along with Mary the mother of Jesus, and his brothers.

POINT: The 120 includes the 11 Apostles and THEY CONTINUED TOGETHER...sounds like they were obeying what Jesus told them to do...return to
Jerusalem and WAIT for the Promise. They were in ONE MIND...sounds like Acts 2 doesn't it?

5) Act 2:4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

POINT: Notice THEY (refers back to the 120) were ALL filled with the Holy Spirit and THEY ALL began to speak with other tongues
POINT: The 11 PLUS those with the 11 were TOLD to go back to
Jerusalem and WAIT for this outpouring! Luke confirms this in Acts 1 where we see the 120 CONTINUING together in obedience to Christ in One mind. We see then again in Acts one THEY were together in ONE MIND and THEY were filled. That is clear and unambiguous.

6) In Acts 1 we see Peter stanging in the MIDST of the 120

Act 1:15 In those days Peter stood up among the believers (a gathering of about one hundred and twenty people) and said,

POINT: Merely being the only one to stand up does not mean the rest of the 120 disappeared as some would suggest. Such a silly notion that when the bible says 'Peter standing with the 11" somehow means everyone else disappeared! All it means is the rest of the 120 did NOT stand up

Act 1:16 "Brothers, the scripture had to be fulfilled that the Holy Spirit foretold through David concerning Judas — who became the guide for those who arrested Jesus —
Act 1:17 for he was counted as one of us and received a share in this ministry."

POINT: REMEMBER..Peter is standing in the MIDST of the 120 when he begins to talk about how they need to elect one of the disciples to fill Judas vacant spot. Whether or not the 120 all participate is irrelevant, but the fact that Peter was speaking TO the 120 IS relevant! They were there through the whole process. Therefore that Peter and the 11 are mentioned directly in no way implies the rest of the 120 left
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