Scoffers on AFF

[Godsdrummer]

Originally Posted by Sean

Aaaah, A voice of reason. Praise God for Bro. Perez!

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Micah was prophesying judgement against Judea by the forces of Sennacherib in 701 B.C.. Also Isaiah 24-27 is just a short time before the attack by Sennacherib, on Jerusalem in 701 B.C. Isaiah 37:21 is the Prophet Isaiah promising Hezekiah concerning the coming destruction of Sennacherib and his armies. No mountains literally melted, stars never fell (which some are 10 times larger than our own star which we call the sun) the solar system didn't roll up. Both prophets are speaking about the same events. Events which concerned literal wars, and the destruction of capitals, one being Samaria the capital of northern kingdom of Israel.

A voice of reason? People read things like stars falling from the sky, mountains melting etc, and never go on to read how those things came to pass, as EB has shown.
You have to ask yourself, what would be the reason for God to have a prophet declare these words to people thousands of years ago if it did not have any meaning to them in that time?
That is like saying God does not speak to his people today. When Peter quoted Joel in Acts 2, he said all those things were happening, including the sun being darkened and moon turned to blood, not some two thousand years in the future.
Futurism reminds me of people that believe the earth is flat and believe in conspiracy theories, like we never walked on the moon. Because someone has taken a verse out of context that seems to speak of the world melting, without studying how that prophecy actually came to pass.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by houston

Referring to first principles, not the sun, moon, and stars.

exactly.

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

without studying how that prophecy actually came to pass.

these are difficult to find, though--they really aren't in Scripture, that i am aware of--which seems weird, come to think of it, if most of the NT was not established until after that. I can't recall any extra-Canon that mentions it, either. Do you have any links for an overview of prophecy fulfilled in 70 ad? Ty

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Sean

Mike, since you are involved and do not agree with what Peter seemingly said, please tell the viewers on AFF what Peter "REALLY" meant by this passage....

10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,

12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?


Is this "really" telling us the Law(heavens), Jewish religion(elements) and the Jews(earth) are ready to dissolved by fire?





Well?

Loren, forget ....LOL

Maybe you will be courteous enough to answer this question for the preterists?

[Sean]

John Owen
"On this foundation I affirm that the heavens and earth here intended in this prophecy of Peter, the coming of the Lord, the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men, mentioned in the destruction of that heaven and earth, do all of them relate, not to the last and final judgment of the world, but to that utter desolation and destruction that was to be made of the Judaical church and state; for which I shall offer these two reasons, of many that might be insisted on from the text:-https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...QP-WMzj491Ry9A




Loren, do you teach what John Owen believed too?(regarding 2 Peter 3)

[J.A. Perez]

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

A voice of reason? People read things like stars falling from the sky, mountains melting etc, and never go on to read how those things came to pass, as EB has shown.
You have to ask yourself, what would be the reason for God to have a prophet declare these words to people thousands of years ago if it did not have any meaning to them in that time?
That is like saying God does not speak to his people today. When Peter quoted Joel in Acts 2, he said all those things were happening, including the sun being darkened and moon turned to blood, not some two thousand years in the future.
Futurism reminds me of people that believe the earth is flat and believe in conspiracy theories, like we never walked on the moon. Because someone has taken a verse out of context that seems to speak of the world melting, without studying how that prophecy actually came to pass.

That is a lame post!

Didn't you know that God prophesied about the Messiah in the garden of Eden. When you read that you probably said " how dare God prophesy something that didn't relate to their day "

Ever heard of Joel 2:28
Or Isaiah 9:6?

Prophecy is not always something that is fulfilled immediately.

Sometimes it takes a while.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by J.A. Perez

That is a lame post!

Didn't you know that God prophesied about the Messiah in the garden of Eden. When you read that you probably said " how dare God prophesy something that didn't relate to their day "

Ever heard of Joel 2:28
Or Isaiah 9:6?

Prophecy is not always something that is fulfilled immediately.

Sometimes it takes a while.

That's not what he is saying, when Isaiah was in the court of Judean kings he was warning them concerning their enemies the Assyrians. When Isaiah prophesies in Isaiah 19:1 against Egypt, the prophet speaks of God coming on a swift cloud against Egypt, and that the idols of Egypt will run away at His presence while the Egyptians melt with fear. Psalm 104:3 speaks of God's chariots being clouds and that the wind actually has wings. Yet, in Isaiah 20:1-3 is another warning of what was prophesied in Isaiah 19:1. Let's not muddy the waters by having a misunderstanding of what the prophets were trying to say to Israel as a warnings. They were warning the kings, and those warnings would be fulfilled just in a short amount of time.

[J.A. Perez]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

That's not what he is saying, when Isaiah was in the court of Judean kings he was warning them concerning their enemies the Assyrians. When Isaiah prophesies in Isaiah 19:1 against Egypt, the prophet speaks of God coming on a swift cloud against Egypt, and that the idols of Egypt will run away at His presence while the Egyptians melt with fear. Psalm 104:3 speaks of God's chariots being clouds and that the wind actually has wings. Yet, in Isaiah 20:1-3 is another warning of what was prophesied in Isaiah 19:1. Let's not muddy the waters by having a misunderstanding of what the prophets were trying to say to Israel as a warnings. They were warning the kings, and those warnings would be fulfilled just in a short amount of time.

Check it out carnal,

I understand A.

All I was doing is showing that the warning was given and the lord performed. And in reference to elements, The definition still stands.

And your boy assembliesofgodsdrummer he's weak bro.

trucha

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by J.A. Perez

Check it out carnal,

I understand A.

All I was doing is showing that the warning was given and the lord performed. And in reference to elements, The definition still stands.

And your boy assembliesofgodsdrummer he's weak bro.

trucha

I don't have a "boy" sir.

I notice you said that GD, was "weak" would you care to explain how his offering was "weak?" GD's post is asking why people misinterpret the signs of sun, moon and stars? How can that be called weak? It can only be addressed by someone proving that the Bible writers intended to mean that stars (some 10 times larger than our own sun) were to fall to the planet earth.

[thephnxman]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

I don't have a "boy" sir.

I notice you said that GD, was "weak" would you care to explain how his offering was "weak?" GD's post is asking why people misinterpret the signs of sun, moon and stars? How can that be called weak? It can only be addressed by someone proving that the Bible writers intended to mean that stars (some 10 times larger than our own sun) were to fall to the planet earth.

"Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened,
and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven,
and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:"

Many read the scriptures and take their words very literally: and they are to be
taken literally...as an historical book. But the Bible is more than historical: there
is a SPIRIT in the words of scripture that also gives life! "...They are Spirit, and they
are life." The "stars will no more fall to the earth, as we could be drawn to them.
Being much larger, they would be denser and have a stronger gravity. Therefore,
the "stars" are they that shone (were saved) and lost their way. It is also speaking
of the coming apostasy, which has already begun!

"And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and
they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever."