Scoffers on AFF

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Sean

Verses that prove the Apostles/ elders were considered "spiritual" fathers...



Rebuke not an elder, but intreat him as a father; and the younger men as brethren;

Unto Timothy, my own son in the faith: Grace, mercy, and peace, from God our Father and Jesus Christ our Lord....

For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.....

To Timothy, my dearly beloved son: Grace, mercy, and peace, from God the Father and Christ Jesus our Lord.....

Behold, the third time I am ready to come to you; and I will not be burdensome to you: for I seek not yours, but you: for the children ought not to lay up for the parents, but the parents for the children....

I write not these things to shame you, but as my beloved sons I warn you.....

For this cause have I sent unto you Timotheus, who is my beloved son, and faithful in the Lord, who shall bring you into remembrance of my ways which be in Christ, as I teach every where in every church.
.....

Here they are.

[Sean]

And yes, the apostle Peter knew he would die(sleep) prior to the end of the age....


John 21:18 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, When thou wast young, thou girdest thyself, and walkedst whither thou wouldest: but when thou shalt be old, thou shalt stretch forth thy hands, and another shall gird thee, and carry thee whither thou wouldest not.

19 This spake he, signifying by what death he should glorify God. And when he had spoken this, he saith unto him, Follow me.

[Sean]

2 That ye may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour:

3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,

4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep(Peter included himself), all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.




Peter says that in the Last Days, before the return of Jesus Christ, scoffers would come and say the founders of Christianity died(including Jesus), and nothing has changed from the beginning of time.

We clearly see that idea perpetuated in this generation, with the belief in the theory of evolution etc..

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Sean

2 That ye may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour:

3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,

4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep(Peter included himself), all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.




Peter says that in the Last Days, before the return of Jesus Christ, scoffers would come and say the founders of Christianity died(including Jesus), and nothing has changed from the beginning of time.

We clearly see that idea perpetuated in this generation, with the belief in the theory of evolution etc..

Did you know that the consensus of sinners(unbelievers)say that all of the Biblical founders(fathers) of Christianity died and are still dead, including Jesus?

Do you think these scoffers believe that Jesus rose from the dead?

You do???

I dare you to say that!

[J.A. Perez]

Sean,

If that was read and considered, we would all have to agree that you have a good point.

But unfortunately since Clement and Polycarp were not preterist.

The preterist on this forum will not except their 1st hand account.

Even though they were disciples of the apostles, and their sons in the gospel.

Jmho

[Sean]

Originally Posted by J.A. Perez

Sean,

If that was read and considered, we would all have to agree that you have a good point.

But unfortunately since Clement and Polycarp were not preterist.

The preterist on this forum will not except their 1st hand account.

Even though they were disciples of the apostles, and their sons in the gospel.

Jmho

Yes my brother, belief in preterism has clouded the minds of men to reach into other sources and abandon the contextual and literal content of the passages.
It is a powerful belief system, that sends them down rabbit holes to follow and vindicate a group such as this....

http://revelationrevolution.org/how-...es-in-genesis/
Heaven and earth have been renewed at least eight times throughout Biblical history and the fulfillment of Biblical prophecy. ....

Whenever a nation was conquered by another, the Bible often portrays this conquest as the destruction and creation of heaven and earth. .....

both Eden and the New Jerusalem are places in both heaven and earth. Thus Genesis 2-3 tells a heavenly story with an earthly shadow. At its heavenly level, Genesis 2-3 is a story about Adam being cast out of the Eden that is in heaven to Earth. The curses of Genesis 3:14-19 were the result of Adam, the Serpent and Eve being cast from heaven to earth to experience these punishments in a world that had presumably already been this way for millennia.....












.http://www.googleadservices.com/page...revolution.org........


You should see the pages of insanity that preterists believe in the post above.






Now Bro. Perez, this is why this argument ensued yesterday, the preterists involved believe this is what 2 Peter 3 is "really" saying....




John Owen
"On this foundation I affirm that the heavens and earth here intended in this prophecy of Peter, the coming of the Lord, the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men, mentioned in the destruction of that heaven and earth, do all of them relate, not to the last and final judgment of the world, but to that utter desolation and destruction that was to be made of the Judaical church and state;...

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...QP-WMzj491Ry9A



Is that just INSANE, or what?...LOL





You see Bro. Perez...Many of these preterist leaning commentators like the one mentioned, lived at a time that Israel was not a nation. They were impatient, then in their haste, began to "spiritualize" the passages about Israel because they were trying to vindicate the Bible and their conceived impossibility of Israel re-emerging as a nation.
They can now rest in their graves and believe the Word of God as it says....Israel IS a nation once again and the prophecies of a coming messiah to reign over Israel and the world are ready to be realized!

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Sean

Yes my brother, belief in preterism has clouded the minds of men to reach into other sources and abandon the contextual and literal content of the passages.
It is a powerful belief system, that sends them down rabbit holes to follow and vindicate a group such as this....

http://revelationrevolution.org/how-...es-in-genesis/
Heaven and earth have been renewed at least eight times throughout Biblical history and the fulfillment of Biblical prophecy. ....

Whenever a nation was conquered by another, the Bible often portrays this conquest as the destruction and creation of heaven and earth. .....

both Eden and the New Jerusalem are places in both heaven and earth. Thus Genesis 2-3 tells a heavenly story with an earthly shadow. At its heavenly level, Genesis 2-3 is a story about Adam being cast out of the Eden that is in heaven to Earth. The curses of Genesis 3:14-19 were the result of Adam, the Serpent and Eve being cast from heaven to earth to experience these punishments in a world that had presumably already been this way for millennia.....












.http://www.googleadservices.com/page...revolution.org........


You should see the pages of insanity that preterists believe in the post above.






Now Bro. Perez, this is why this argument ensued yesterday, the preterists involved believe this is what 2 Peter 3 is "really" saying....




John Owen
"On this foundation I affirm that the heavens and earth here intended in this prophecy of Peter, the coming of the Lord, the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men, mentioned in the destruction of that heaven and earth, do all of them relate, not to the last and final judgment of the world, but to that utter desolation and destruction that was to be made of the Judaical church and state;...

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...QP-WMzj491Ry9A



Is that just INSANE, or what?...LOL





You see Bro. Perez...Many of these preterist leaning commentators like the one mentioned, lived at a time that Israel was not a nation. They were impatient, then in their haste, began to "spiritualize" the passages about Israel because they were trying to vindicate the Bible and their conceived impossibility of Israel re-emerging as a nation.
They can now rest in their graves and believe the Word of God as it says....Israel IS a nation once again and the prophecies of a coming messiah to reign over Israel and the world are ready to be realized!

Hey everyone, Benencasa thinks that the HEAVENS in 2 Peter 3 is "REALLY" supposed to mean the JEWISH LAW of MOSES and the EARTH is supposed to mean the Jews themselves.....

Benencasa thinks Peter was "really" saying The Jewish law and the Jews were to pass away with fervent heat(in secret code)!!!!...LOL

This is why he is twisting 2 Peter 3!!!...LOL


He thinks it is supposed to mean this....



John Owen
"On this foundation I affirm that the heavens and earth here intended in this prophecy of Peter, the coming of the Lord, the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men, mentioned in the destruction of that heaven and earth, do all of them relate, not to the last and final judgment of the world, but to that utter desolation and destruction that was to be made of the Judaical church and state; for which I shall offer these two reasons, of many that might be insisted on from the text:-https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...QP-WMzj491Ry9A

[Sean]

John Owen
"On this foundation I affirm that the heavens and earth here intended in this prophecy of Peter, the coming of the Lord, the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men, mentioned in the destruction of that heaven and earth, do all of them relate, not to the last and final judgment of the world, but to that utter desolation and destruction that was to be made of the Judaical church and state; for which I shall offer these two reasons, of many that might be insisted on from the text:-https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...QP-WMzj491Ry9A[/QUOTE]





Do you agree with John Owen, Mike?

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Sean

Hey everyone, Mike thinks that the HEAVENS in 2 Peter 3 is "REALLY" supposed to mean the JEWISH LAW of MOSES and the EARTH is supposed to mean the Jews themselves.....

Mike thinks Peter was "really" saying The Jewish law and the Jews were to pass away with fervent heat(in secret code)!!!!...LOL




He thinks it is supposed to mean this....



John Owen
"On this foundation I affirm that the heavens and earth here intended in this prophecy of Peter, the coming of the Lord, the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men, mentioned in the destruction of that heaven and earth, do all of them relate, not to the last and final judgment of the world, but to that utter desolation and destruction that was to be made of the Judaical church and state; for which I shall offer these two reasons, of many that might be insisted on from the text:-https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...QP-WMzj491Ry9A

Mike, can I insert your name here too?

[houston]

And maybe they'd find something they'd rather do than to enter the ministry.