Dear James, would you be so kind as to tell us why?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Admin
As you stated, this is a privately funded forum. Those who post here, are guests in another person's house. As guests, they are expected to abide by the rules as they are stated. If you are unaware of the rules of this forum, you can find a direct link to them in the signature below.
Absent going into a lot of "legalese" the above answer is great, and was actually an analogy I was going to use. You have a LOT more individual rights to regulate what one says in YOUR home than you do what that same person chooses to say in a park, or street corner.
Absent going into a lot of "legalese" the above answer is great, and was actually an analogy I was going to use. You have a LOT more individual rights to regulate what one says in YOUR home than you do what that same person chooses to say in a park, or street corner.
Is the AFF a home or a club? A home usually doesn't have people visiting from all across the country at the same time. This is a public forum held privately.
First of all, we are not all American here. We are blessed to have a number of very fine Canadian brothers and sisters (and one dear virtual Auntie) posting with us on AFF.
Second of all, the Constitution, does not give Americans unequivocal right to freedom of any speech in any place.
The American Constitution provides that no American will be persecuted by the United States Government for speaking against the government.
While you can say anything on AFF and be free from Governmental intervention (with the exception of stating illegal things like making terroristic threats), you have no constitutional protection for what you say as it relates to private entities.
For instance, if you work for ABC Company, and you issue a statement against the sitting president of the United States, that is laden with profanities, while at work, the government will do nothing, but your employer is free to fire your sorry rear for being profane.
If you went on the radio and said very bad things about some race, the government will not come arrest you, but you can be fired from your job, loose all your friends, and end up in a divorce if your spouse chooses that course of action.
In both cases the constitutional protections remain in place, but the consequences of your actions in the private sector might be detrimental to your well being.
AFF is no different. You are free to say that St Matt is an ugly nefarious religious zealot bent on riding the world of your favorite fava bean, and the government will not toss you in jail. BOOM however, is free to ban you from the forum and make jokes about fava lovers and how they are all bound to eat spinach in eternity.
I hope that explains James’ resounding and succinct “NO”.
Thank you all for playing. (not the management)
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
First of all, we are not all American here. We are blessed to have a number of very fine Canadian brothers and sisters (and one dear virtual Auntie) posting with us on AFF.
Second of all, the Constitution, does not give Americans unequivocal right to freedom of any speech in any place.
The American Constitution provides that no American will be persecuted by the United States Government for speaking against the government.
While you can say anything on AFF and be free from Governmental intervention (with the exception of stating illegal things like making terroristic threats), you have no constitutional protection for what you say as it relates to private entities.
For instance, if you work for ABC Company, and you issue a statement against the sitting president of the United States, that is laden with profanities, while at work, the government will do nothing, but your employer is free to fire your sorry rear for being profane.
If you went on the radio and said very bad things about some race, the government will not come arrest you, but you can be fired from your job, loose all your friends, and end up in a divorce if your spouse chooses that course of action.
In both cases the constitutional protections remain in place, but the consequences of your actions in the private sector might be detrimental to your well being.
AFF is no different. You are free to say that St Matt is an ugly nefarious religious zealot bent on riding the world of your favorite fava bean, and the government will not toss you in jail. BOOM however, is free to ban you from the forum and make jokes about fava lovers and how they are all bound to eat spinach in eternity.
I hope that explains James’ resounding and succinct “NO”.
Thank you all for playing. (not the management)
Thanks, interesting answer. I'm still unsure of the internet communal definition as a home.
What am I asking is this: Does that mean no jews, blacks, gays, etc. A privately held club like a "men's club" cannot exclude women legally. This has been challenged in the courts and has been defeated.
It wasn't that long ago that blacks were not allowed on some golf courses in the south or in the country clubs even though those clubs had private rules. I understand we are guests, but can the "homeowner" make rules that violate our civil rights?
groups or classes cannot be excluded on the basis of their belonging to some particular class. However individuals within any class can be excluded on the basis of their actions.
For instance, in your personal strip club (which you referenced above) you cannot exclude women, however if Renda were to show up with a sign stating that you and all your employees were going to hell for being in your strip club, they you could toss Renda even though she was right.
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
First of all, we are not all American here. We are blessed to have a number of very fine Canadian brothers and sisters (and one dear virtual Auntie) posting with us on AFF.
Second of all, the Constitution, does not give Americans unequivocal right to freedom of any speech in any place.
The American Constitution provides that no American will be persecuted by the United States Government for speaking against the government.
While you can say anything on AFF and be free from Governmental intervention (with the exception of stating illegal things like making terroristic threats), you have no constitutional protection for what you say as it relates to private entities.
For instance, if you work for ABC Company, and you issue a statement against the sitting president of the United States, that is laden with profanities, while at work, the government will do nothing, but your employer is free to fire your sorry rear for being profane.
If you went on the radio and said very bad things about some race, the government will not come arrest you, but you can be fired from your job, loose all your friends, and end up in a divorce if your spouse chooses that course of action.
In both cases the constitutional protections remain in place, but the consequences of your actions in the private sector might be detrimental to your well being.
AFF is no different. You are free to say that St Matt is an ugly nefarious religious zealot bent on riding the world of your favorite fava bean, and the government will not toss you in jail. BOOM however, is free to ban you from the forum and make jokes about fava lovers and how they are all bound to eat spinach in eternity.
I hope that explains James’ resounding and succinct “NO”.
I'm wondering if our God given inalienable rights as human beings applies to AFF? Since this is a religious internet communal and I assume we are all Americans, shouldn't we have the same freedom of expression here as we do in public?
I realize this is a privately funded forum, nevertheless the tentacles of our laws extend into the crevices of private corporations. I am unaware of any private clubs that have the power to supercede the Bill of Rights?
Is it lawful to ban individuals who intimidate the scripturally weak? Is it further lawful to censure threads that speak against the Administration?
If we were in Cuba I would understand.
Nothing to do with freedom of speech. Everthing to do with revelation cramping.
We are supposed to gleam our revelation of the fullness of God only from the bible and those who have written some book before us.
The Bible I understand but God is still revealing himself to mankind.
We however do not want to hear anything more than sounds of the past...
I love the sounds of the past, but what is the beat for 2008.
QUOTE=staysharp;344267]What am I asking is this: Does that mean no jews, blacks, gays, etc. A privately held club like a "men's club" cannot exclude women legally. This has been challenged in the courts and has been defeated.
It wasn't that long ago that blacks were not allowed on some golf courses in the south or in the country clubs even though those clubs had private rules. I understand we are guests, but can the "homeowner" make rules that violate our civil rights?[/QUOTE]
One last post on the topic and I will start charging. :-)
You are presenting two very different issues.
One is free speech, the other is discriminatory exclusion.
Free speech is much more able to be regulated in a private forum.
AFF does NOT practice discriminatory exclusion. ALL are welcome.
They just must follow the rules WHICH WERE AGREED TO BEFORE JOINING
The hypothetical in which you listed race, religion etc and to which you referred to as having a right to join "a club": First in all instances it is not an absolute right, but more importantly once joined they still have to follow the rules they agreed to.
So once again, freedom of speech can be limited (ESPECIALLY by agreement), and there is NO discriminatory exclusion here.
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