On the other hand I have been saying for about 29 years Oneness Churches have been running people off in multitudes because of some unscriptural dress code teachings. So it is partly their own fault if the joy of walking in truth is fading among them.
I see your point there. But people who are in Oneness, and take issue with the dress code issues, can find a Oneness church that doesnt have the dress code issues. In most such cases I've seen, there are several such churches believers could choose from, if they want to find them.
I dont think "dress code issues" should be an excuse for someone changing from Oneness to Trinitarian -- although some have made it an excuse. I just dont buy it though. When I see people leave Oneness churches and make wholesale doctrinal changes, I have to wonder how solid those people were on their doctrinal positions in the first place.
__________________ http://endtimeobserver.blogspot.com
Daniel 12:3 And those who are wise shall shine like the brightness of the firmament; and those who turn many to righteousness, like the stars for ever.
...
On the other hand I have been saying for about 29 years Oneness Churches have been running people off in multitudes because of some unscriptural dress code teachings. So it is partly their own fault if the joy of walking in truth is fading among them.
There are folks who would like to go to a church where baptism is performed in Jesus' name but there is so much "garbage" to listen to and put up with like
--clothesline preaching;
--"holiness" or hell where the "holiness is somebody's weird ideas and personal preferences;
--stay away from those folks over there because they don't look just like us;
--don't make any personal decisions without consulting the pastor;
--don't work any job with evening of Sunday hours
--don't miss any scheduled service
--touch not (don't question in any way or disagree with in any manner) God's anointed because he holds the key to your salvation
--etc. etc.
a generation from now a lot of folk posting in this thread would be asking the following question:
What is the doctrine of Oneness?
Hey Ferd,
I don't doubt that what you say is true as to the "Oneness" doctrine, however it is my opinion that the OP teaching has penetrated far beyond the OP walls. It may not be understood as "Oneness" but it certainly is a clearer understanding of who God is, that I sense in many places that most OP's consider Trinity. Is there really anything particularly sacred about the oneness label? jmho
__________________ For it is written, "As I live, says the Lord every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall give praise to God. (Romans 14:11- NASB)
Hey Ferd,
I don't doubt that what you say is true as to the "Oneness" doctrine, however it is my opinion that the OP teaching has penetrated far beyond the OP walls. It may not be understood as "Oneness" but it certainly is a clearer understanding of who God is, that I sense in many places that most OP's consider Trinity. Is there really anything particularly sacred about the oneness label? jmho
Crackjack for me doctrine matters. i know a lot of people here see it somewhat differntly. they view their understanding of God as maybe more "clear" than others but it really is a minor issue.
it isnt minor for a lot of us. Anyone who believes that Acts 2:38 is the proper response to the Gospel has to have a hard time even thinking of going to a trinitarian church.
Sacred? Well I am not sure how to respond to that question. Without question, I believe the revalation of who God is, is precious. I view my understanding of the doctrines of salvation as bedrock. As foundational. leaving those things for something else is to leave the foundation. It is to walk out the front door and then try to sneek back into the house via a window.
I vew Jesus' words (there is only one door and those who try to enter some other way are thieves) as sacred.
I cannot fathom the trade some have made. I have made friends here who believe differently than I do. I respect the decisions others have made, even though I cannot for the life of me, understand why they would.
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
Crackjack for me doctrine matters. i know a lot of people here see it somewhat differntly. they view their understanding of God as maybe more "clear" than others but it really is a minor issue.
it isnt minor for a lot of us. Anyone who believes that Acts 2:38 is the proper response to the Gospel has to have a hard time even thinking of going to a trinitarian church.
Sacred? Well I am not sure how to respond to that question. Without question, I believe the revalation of who God is, is precious. I view my understanding of the doctrines of salvation as bedrock. As foundational. leaving those things for something else is to leave the foundation. It is to walk out the front door and then try to sneek back into the house via a window.
I vew Jesus' words (there is only one door and those who try to enter some other way are thieves) as sacred.
I cannot fathom the trade some have made. I have made friends here who believe differently than I do. I respect the decisions others have made, even though I cannot for the life of me, understand why they would.
Hey Ferd long time no see. Where you been?
Do you consider Spirit filled Trinitarians as thieves? Are they trying to get in by anything other than the door?
__________________
"Beware lest you lose the substance by grasping at the shadow." ~Aesop
Do you consider Spirit filled Trinitarians as thieves? Are they trying to get in by anything other than the door?
My friend, its good to see you too! Ive been working. Its been getting in the way of just about everything.
Have you visited the "Are Trinitarians Lost" thread?
Baron, I find no pleasure at all in anyone being lost. Nor do I make the decision. I am much mroe comfortable leaving that to God.
What I do know is that I have been given a singular and precious truth. Walking away from that truth will cause ME to be lost and I surely dont want to do that. Walking away from this truth will jepordize my two sons salvatoin. I certainly cannot consience that.
Short of a fellow thinking that our doctrine has less value, I cannot see why any Oneness person would walk away and join with non-oneness people.
Baron, will your grandchildren understand your view of who God is? Do you care?
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
Crackjack for me doctrine matters. i know a lot of people here see it somewhat differntly. they view their understanding of God as maybe more "clear" than others but it really is a minor issue.
it isnt minor for a lot of us. Anyone who believes that Acts 2:38 is the proper response to the Gospel has to have a hard time even thinking of going to a trinitarian church.
Sacred? Well I am not sure how to respond to that question. Without question, I believe the revalation of who God is, is precious. I view my understanding of the doctrines of salvation as bedrock. As foundational. leaving those things for something else is to leave the foundation. It is to walk out the front door and then try to sneek back into the house via a window.
I vew Jesus' words (there is only one door and those who try to enter some other way are thieves) as sacred.
I cannot fathom the trade some have made. I have made friends here who believe differently than I do. I respect the decisions others have made, even though I cannot for the life of me, understand why they would.
Bro,
I understand where you are coming from. My question was: is the label "oneness" sacred, being that it is not a biblical term.
Please, man no one is suggesting any other door that Jesus. The Word is sacred, but tradition is not sacred.
If folks are coming to a clearer understanding of who God is, isn't that a good thing, is not the Holy Spirit at work? I believe He is at work more than we can imagine.
Blessings to you and yours.
__________________ For it is written, "As I live, says the Lord every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall give praise to God. (Romans 14:11- NASB)
I attended a trinity school in high school. I think it was Church of God Holiness, but I can't remember for sure. It might have been AoG Holiness???? I must be getting old...
Anyway, the principal (and pastor) had a daughter and her husband who attended his church. They got angry at him for allowing oneness kids to attend the school (that would be me and about 5 others), and quit his church. (He refused to kick us out or make us sign a statement.) In their opinion, we shouldn't have been allowed to attend unless our parents were willing to sign a doctrinal statement affirming the Trinity.
That is certainly not the first nor only time I have encountered dogmatic trinitarianism.
So while there ARE many trinitarians who really don't understand or can't explain the Godhead, and probably believe their church believes in one God, I don't buy the idea that all trinitarians really believe the same way we do. The fact is--they don't. And in doctrinal discussions with ministers and more educated constituents, you will find they usually DO believe in three distinct persons in the Godhead.
Ergo, whether someone in the church understands the trinitarian doctrine or not, the trinitarian church as a whole DOES understand it, and officially supports it. Most do NOT support the oneness doctrine as we would explain it or believe it.
There are denominations and non-denominational churches that choose to set aside differences of doctrine, but that is not the norm among most organizations in my experience.
__________________
"God, send me anywhere, only go with me. Lay any burden on me, only sustain me. And sever any tie in my heart except the tie that binds my heart to Yours."
--David Livingstone
"To see no being, not God’s or any, but you also go thither,
To see no possession but you may possess it—enjoying all without labor or purchase—
abstracting the feast, yet not abstracting one particle of it;…."
--Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass, Song of the Open Road
So while there ARE many trinitarians who really don't understand or can't explain the Godhead, and probably believe their church believes in one God, I don't buy the idea that all trinitarians really believe the same way we do. The fact is--they don't. And in doctrinal discussions with ministers and more educated constituents, you will find they usually DO believe in three distinct persons in the Godhead.
Ergo, whether someone in the church understands the trinitarian doctrine or not, the trinitarian church as a whole DOES understand it, and officially supports it. Most do NOT support the oneness doctrine as we would explain it or believe it.
There are denominations and non-denominational churches that choose to set aside differences of doctrine, but that is not the norm among most organizations in my experience.
__________________ http://endtimeobserver.blogspot.com
Daniel 12:3 And those who are wise shall shine like the brightness of the firmament; and those who turn many to righteousness, like the stars for ever.
I attended a trinity school in high school. I think it was Church of God Holiness, but I can't remember for sure. It might have been AoG Holiness???? I must be getting old...
Anyway, the principal (and pastor) had a daughter and her husband who attended his church. They got angry at him for allowing oneness kids to attend the school (that would be me and about 5 others), and quit his church. (He refused to kick us out or make us sign a statement.) In their opinion, we shouldn't have been allowed to attend unless our parents were willing to sign a doctrinal statement affirming the Trinity.
That is certainly not the first nor only time I have encountered dogmatic trinitarianism.
So while there ARE many trinitarians who really don't understand or can't explain the Godhead, and probably believe their church believes in one God, I don't buy the idea that all trinitarians really believe the same way we do. The fact is--they don't. And in doctrinal discussions with ministers and more educated constituents, you will find they usually DO believe in three distinct persons in the Godhead.
Ergo, whether someone in the church understands the trinitarian doctrine or not, the trinitarian church as a whole DOES understand it, and officially supports it. Most do NOT support the oneness doctrine as we would explain it or believe it.
There are denominations and non-denominational churches that choose to set aside differences of doctrine, but that is not the norm among most organizations in my experience.
Exactly.
Our Oneness bibleschools cannot get acredited, not because of the quality of the education but because our schools do not teach the trinity.
That is a simple fact. No undergrad bibleschool that teaches Oneness doctrine can get an acredidation thru a christian school crediting system if they dont teach the trinity. and we cant use non-christian acredidation because we are christian schools.
THEY CARE.
I dont understand some of us dont.
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
Hybrid Mode
