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01-02-2008, 09:09 PM
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Unvaxxed Pureblood too
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 40,802
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover
My statement was made purely from observation, and discussion with longtime UPC ministers/membership. While limiting the statement to "ministers" may make it less accurate, I believe there are very few ministers who do not watch television, given opportunity, and even fewer of the membership. For the ministers it may not generally include ownership.
Minister's manuals.... I don't have them and don't care too much what they say, but my view would be that the intent of the authors was to limit exposure of worliness commonly found on TV AND the internet. Me not having TV has nothing to do with any prohibition to do so.
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Brother Hoover, the reason that I asked for statistics was because you made a comment that only a minority held to a no-television-view. You then came back and posted you had no such statistics to uphold your view and that it was only an opinion formulated by a discussion among some ministers. Now, what I find interesting is that you still want to offer me your "belief" that there are "few" ministers in the UPCI who DON'T WATCH television.
Again, I must respectfully say that doesn't prove anything.
We can make statements that we hold beliefs on many different views and that others believe the same as we, but that still doesn't make it so.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover
Yes we were on national TV - it was a wonderful experience. I don't think it brings up any question of our faith...
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Brother Hoover, I wasn't questioning your faith, please forgive me if you thought that. I was questioning whether it was allowed by the UPCI ministerial manual? (that's if you're a UPCI card holder). Brother Hoover I understand that a licensed minister can be on the television if it's news related, but not a television show.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover
it is like getting a write-up in a national newspaper, but then, I don't keep the New York Times on my coffeee table either.
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Brother Hoover, was it really like having a write-up in a national newpaper? Wasn't the television show you and your family were on called Wife Swap? This show is far from being a write up in USA Today, it's more like being on The Osbournes. 
Brother Hoover, so whats up with that?
In Jesus name
Brother Benincasa
www.OnTimeJournal.com
__________________
"all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed."
~Declaration of Independence
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01-02-2008, 09:48 PM
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Supercalifragilisticexpiali...
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 19,197
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa
Brother Hoover, the reason that I asked for statistics was because you made a comment that only a minority held to a no-television-view. You then came back and posted you had no such statistics to uphold your view and that it was only an opinion formulated by a discussion among some ministers. Now, what I find interesting is that you still want to offer me your "belief" that there are "few" ministers in the UPCI who DON'T WATCH television.
Again, I must respectfully say that doesn't prove anything.
We can make statements that we hold beliefs on many different views and that others believe the same as we, but that still doesn't make it so.
Brother Hoover, I wasn't questioning your faith, please forgive me if you thought that. I was questioning whether it was allowed by the UPCI ministerial manual? (that's if you're a UPCI card holder). Brother Hoover I understand that a licensed minister can be on the television if it's news related, but not a television show.
Brother Hoover, was it really like having a write-up in a national newpaper? Wasn't the television show you and your family were on called Wife Swap? This show is far from being a write up in USA Today, it's more like being on The Osbournes.
Brother Hoover, so whats up with that?
In Jesus name
Brother Benincasa
www.OnTimeJournal.com |
Of course my opinion is just that and nothing more, there are no such stats. I can only speak from that which I know - same as you.
What's up with the Hoover's being on ABC's Wife Swap?
Here is what other's have said...
THE CASE FOR REALITY TV
BY MICHAEL HIRSCHORN
“Value systems are smashed into each other, like atoms in an accelerator, on ABC’s Wife Swap, where the producers find the most extreme pairings possible: lesbian mommies with bigots, godless cosmopolites with Bible thumpers. On one February show, a Pentecostal family, the Hoovers, was paired with the family of a former pastor, Tony Meeks, who has turned from God to follow his rock-and-roll dreams (mom Tish rocks out as well). “I feel by being there,” Kristin Hoover said, “I was able to remind Tony that God still loves him and is not finished with him.” The episode took seriously the Hoovers’ commitment to homeschooling and their rejection of contemporary culture (a rejection not taken to the extreme of declining an invitation to appear on reality TV). Compare this with the tokenism of “born-again Christian” Harriet Hayes on NBC’s dramedy Studio 60 on the Sunset Strip. Harriet’s but a cipher, a rhetorical backboard against which ex-boyfriend Matt Albie can thwack his heathen wisecracks.”
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"Kristen I was inspired by you and your family. I watched as you refused to let your guard down in even the simplest of things. You remained steadfast and strong in what you believe and I admire you for that. I especially liked what you said at the end of the show, that the most romantic thing Steve could have done for you was to protect your daughters’ modesty."
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“I also have to give props to the Hoover family who, being the most conservative family I've ever met, do not judge others....despite any indication otherwise you may have gotten from the show. They are very respectful people and likewise, we respect them and their way of life. They are great representatives of Christians everywhere and if there were more people out there like them, maybe Christians wouldn't get such a bad rep.”
--Tish Meeks
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"I would like to tell the mom what a wonderful job she did representing the Christian community. It doesn't matter that she was from a different religion than the Meeks or even our family, she had a ton of grace. ...
...I was thrilled as a youth pastor in a non-denominational church to see a Christian not try to "change the world" in a day, but show her grace, love and compassion, non-judgementally and through who she was, not who she "said" she was. She lived her convictions, and let her "light shine" through her life, not through harsh words or condemnation. She did just what the Bible instructs us to do, and I wanted to commend her for that."
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"Since that night Kristen and I try to have Bible study and prayer at least once a week.
Our family has been honored to attend a powerful church service with the entire Hoover family. We had much fun and felt so at home with them that there is no doubt we have gained a great and everlasting friendship. Not only here, on this earth, but for ETERNITY as well.
Their testimony from the show and knowing them personally has changed the lives of my family...........
Thank you "Hoover Family" for listening and doing God's will.”
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Also EB, Others we have connected with through the airing of the show have been filled with the Holy Spirit and baptised in Jesus Name.
So... that's what's up with that.
AND I am still not interested in TV or watching "Wife Swap" .
__________________
"It is inhumane, in my opinion, to force people who have a genuine medical need for coffee to wait in line behind people who apparently view it as some kind of recreational activity." Dave Barry 2005
I am a firm believer in the Old Paths
Articles on such subjects as "The New Birth," will be accepted, whether they teach that the new birth takes place before baptism in water and Spirit, or that the new birth consists of baptism of water and Spirit. - THE PENTECOSTAL HERALD Dec. 1945
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves
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01-02-2008, 10:23 PM
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Unvaxxed Pureblood too
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 40,802
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover
Of course my opinion is just that and nothing more, there are no such stats. I can only speak from that which I know - same as you.
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I totally agree, but you made it sound as you were speaking fact, so if left unchallenged it might be taken as such. I think the television problem is bigger than one might believe.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover
What's up with the Hoover's being on ABC's Wife Swap?
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Brother Hoover, are you a UPCI licensed minister?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover
Also EB, Others we have connected with through the airing of the show have been filled with the Holy Spirit and baptised in Jesus Name.
So... that's what's up with that.
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Brother Hoover, 10, 20, 100, 5,000? What are we talking about? 3,000 converted on the day of Pentecost, so talk to me, every single Televangelist has deep sixed the Gospel, and now UPCI has voted in Televised Pentecost. What I am trying to ask is this, where are all the One God Pentecostal ministers who have converted thousands via the tube?
Please keep in mind that no other group (aside for some independent Apostolics) have a ruling against television, so where are all those converts?
You got some people baptized and filled with the Holy Ghost, bravo in Jesus name. I am very happy to hear this, but what about the long term?
Also I am not asking you how many were filled or baptized, I am asking you if you're UPCI how did you get on the television when your manual says you can't be on any kind of program like the one you were on?
No offence but what's up with that?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover
AND I am still not interested in TV or watching "Wife Swap" . |
Please forgive me Brother Hoover, but do you really think that is plain and simple?
In Jesus name
Brother Benincasa
www.OnTimeJournal.com
__________________
"all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed."
~Declaration of Independence
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01-02-2008, 10:39 PM
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Supercalifragilisticexpiali...
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 19,197
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I did not mean to avoid this.
No, I am not a UPCI licensed minister. I have no organizational manual.
I don't care about TV -- sorry, but I truely believe it is a non-issue. How many souls are won by internet? Podcasting? etc etc etc...
At some point it becomes a little foolish.
Some of this is a bit deja vu for me.
Recently a group of Old Order (horse and Buggy) Mennonites in Ontario Canada has allowed laptop computers for their members, but they still forbid electricity, and automobiles.
This group is considered ultra con because of a prohibition on electricity - unlike the larger OOM groups.
When a split claims special purity over a prohibition of "stuff" I am wary of it.
Did Jim Jones have a huge TV ministry?
Who really cares? I know I don't.
__________________
"It is inhumane, in my opinion, to force people who have a genuine medical need for coffee to wait in line behind people who apparently view it as some kind of recreational activity." Dave Barry 2005
I am a firm believer in the Old Paths
Articles on such subjects as "The New Birth," will be accepted, whether they teach that the new birth takes place before baptism in water and Spirit, or that the new birth consists of baptism of water and Spirit. - THE PENTECOSTAL HERALD Dec. 1945
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves
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01-02-2008, 10:50 PM
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Unvaxxed Pureblood too
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 40,802
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover
I did not mean to avoid this.
No, I am not a UPCI licensed minister. I have no organizational manual.
I don't care about TV -- sorry, but I truely believe it is a non-issue. How many souls are won by internet? Podcasting? etc etc etc...
At some point it becomes a little foolish.
Some of this is a bit deja vu for me.
Recently a group of Old Order (horse and Buggy) Mennonites in Ontario Canada has allowed laptop computers for their members, but they still forbid electricity, and automobiles.
This group is considered ultra con because of a prohibition on electricity - unlike the larger OOM groups.
Did Jim Jones have a huge TV ministry?
Who really cares? I know I don't.
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Brother Hoover, thank you for answering my question.
Since you are not a UPCer then you can do as you very well please concerning the tube. As for me being on a show called Wife Swap, is a little too bizarre. But hey, I'm just an ex-biker what do I know. I think American Christiandom is shot in the head and lays in the gutter bleeding.
You Brothers are just way to smart for this guy, you are going to out do all the A.A. Allens, Benny Hinns, and Jimmy Swaggarts.
Televised America here comes the Pentecostals!!!!
Brother Hoover, I mean you no harm and hope you are not offended, I just don't get it. Please forgive me for that.
In Jesus name
Brother Benincasa
www.OnTimeJournal.com
__________________
"all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed."
~Declaration of Independence
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01-02-2008, 10:54 PM
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Supercalifragilisticexpiali...
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 19,197
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa
Brother Hoover, thank you for answering my question.
Since you are not a UPCer then you can do as you very well please concerning the tube. As for me being on a show called Wife Swap, is a little too bizarre. But hey, I'm just an ex-biker what do I know. I think American Christiandom is shot in the head and lays in the gutter bleeding.
You Brothers are just way to smart for this guy, you are going to out do all the A.A. Allens, Benny Hinns, and Jimmy Swaggarts.
Televised America here comes the Pentecostals!!!!
Brother Hoover, I mean you no harm and hope you are not offended, I just don't get it. Please forgive me for that.
In Jesus name
Brother Benincasa
www.OnTimeJournal.com |
Not at all, and if needed - forgive me as well, please.
Steve Hoover
PS I do attend a church pastored by a UPC pastor
__________________
"It is inhumane, in my opinion, to force people who have a genuine medical need for coffee to wait in line behind people who apparently view it as some kind of recreational activity." Dave Barry 2005
I am a firm believer in the Old Paths
Articles on such subjects as "The New Birth," will be accepted, whether they teach that the new birth takes place before baptism in water and Spirit, or that the new birth consists of baptism of water and Spirit. - THE PENTECOSTAL HERALD Dec. 1945
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves
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01-02-2008, 11:21 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 334
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bro steve i'm sure u get a lot of publicity both good and bad from the show ya'll were on. i read your previous post and i think you're a great example of being in the world but not of it. u used a device that is often used for evil and turned it into something positive...looks like ya'll are still seeing results of that. pretty awesome opportunity...maybe u should have been one of the lead debators on the "for" advertising side at GC...lol
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01-02-2008, 11:34 PM
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Supercalifragilisticexpiali...
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 19,197
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SavedLou
bro steve i'm sure u get a lot of publicity both good and bad from the show ya'll were on. i read your previous post and i think you're a great example of being in the world but not of it. u used a device that is often used for evil and turned it into something positive...looks like ya'll are still seeing results of that. pretty awesome opportunity...maybe u should have been one of the lead debators on the "for" advertising side at GC...lol |
Hi there SL and Welcome to AFF!
"...pretty awesome opportunity" yea we agree with you on that. As to me being pro TV... well I don't watch it! LOL!
I do think the UPC can stand a healthy dose of tolerance in many areas, and TV should be used, (or not) much like other forms of media WITH MUCH CAUTION.
With greater liberty comes greater responsibility, and a higher level of maturity is required. We have more to gain than to lose.
__________________
"It is inhumane, in my opinion, to force people who have a genuine medical need for coffee to wait in line behind people who apparently view it as some kind of recreational activity." Dave Barry 2005
I am a firm believer in the Old Paths
Articles on such subjects as "The New Birth," will be accepted, whether they teach that the new birth takes place before baptism in water and Spirit, or that the new birth consists of baptism of water and Spirit. - THE PENTECOSTAL HERALD Dec. 1945
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves
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01-03-2008, 12:04 AM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 334
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover
Hi there SL and Welcome to AFF!
"...pretty awesome opportunity" yea we agree with you on that. As to me being pro TV... well I don't watch it! LOL!
I do think the UPC can stand a healthy dose of tolerance in many areas, and TV should be used, (or not) much like other forms of media WITH MUCH CAUTION.
With greater liberty comes greater responsibility, and a higher level of maturity is required. We have more to gain than to lose.
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i agree! it's about balance and moderation in all things...tv, internet, etc. anything can be destructive or a thief of time if we allow it. boils down to self control. i also believe that very soon tv/computers will merge and people will sit on their couch and use their remotes to get online, etc. don't know what the UPC will do then...interesting. i respect your decision to not have one but i can tell you are balanced and not condemning of those who do. 
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