Ministerial Ethics, a different perspective

[Sister Alvear]

Well, I have my own thoughts about this subject. The first thought that comes to my mind is you cannot please everybody!
Church hoppers will always exist.
Churches mean different things to different people.
Some had rather get lost in the sea of people just to be among church goers but not a doer...
No pastor can please everybody.
Some people just live for the thrill of being the new comer at some church the new wears off and they are gone.
Some people will never be loyal.
The most ideal church that we can think of has people coming and going...that is a fact of life...

Sometimes people don´t fit in ...like a foreign body...they are just not a part...

Sometimes pastors don´t want certain people because they are trouble.

Those things are just off the top of my hat...why sheep wander...and dear ones FEW REAL SHEEP WANDER they KNOW the voice of their pastor...

Too many times it is a goat or a wolf....a real sheep will sit down and talk things out with the pastor not behind his back to the pastor across town that very seldom knows the real nature of the sheep or the problem...

We have a rather large work. In the state of Sao Paulo alone not counting any other state we have over 500 registered ministers...So believe me I see lots of things...Some people the pastor is glad to see go not because he does not love souls BUT because he does love souls and some people just destroy.

I had a rather long talk just not long ago with a pastor and his wife about this same subject. They wanted to know how to deal with someone that was insisting on this or that. I told them to ignore the person. Some people want your total attention and even if you gave it to them they woud not do right. I told a group of preachers last night the devil knows how to get all our attention on some problem, some person, some this or that to distract us from doing the REAL work of God.

Every church will always have some unhappy people that try to contaminate others. Late last night someone walked into my office and saw a picture of someone that gave us so many headaches...and a picture of someone that tried to play both sides of the fence....Why don´t you tear these pictures up, missionary the person said...OH no I replied looking at them makes me so thankful for the host of faithful ones...

So everybody serves a purpose sadly some people are just scaffold. I really weep for these that sometimes give so much but never serve for any lasting purpose…

[Sister Alvear]

Real life experiences teach us lots of things.
One experience I have learned is a problem one place is a problem another place...who commits sin one place will commit sin another place...who is a misfit because of character flaws will be a misfit somewhere else. Who sides with trouble makers will side with trouble makers where ever they are...
The root of many problems comes from the depth of an evil heart...people watched someone running from one house to another...run to me with the story...I just smiled and said...people that play on both sides end up with no friends at all...I have watched it happen over and over in 40 years of ministry and a total of almost 50 years preaching! Remember I started preaching as a kid...
I just had some fault finders at my house…lol…they have been members of all the churches in the area where they live so it was of no surprise to me that they wanted to tell me how to run our church.
This is just an example to help you younger ones in ministry. I called a meeting (Brother Alvear is traveling) so our co pastor came, Pastor Michal Pastor Ednei (our sons) and several more and got him an interrupter for him to express what he felt we were doing wrong…
One of the things he was so up in the air about was at a house meeting Michael had let a trinity lady sing a song! On and on he rambled…finally Michael asked him if he could tell us how many trinity people he had won to his church where he is a member…;well he fumbled around a while and said he had witnessed to a few…but won none…
Michael told him you see my mother sitting here she is m example and all my life I have seen her be kind to trinity folks and never say they serve a different God or make derogatory remarks about them…would you like to know how many hundreds she has won?
So without going into details I told him to please pray for us and forgive our lack of spirituality and Sunday he could stay in his room if he felt that our church was not spiritual enough for him and there would be no hard feelings on my part…I sure would appreciate someone praying several hours for me! But he decided to be humble and come…and HE WATCHED us baptize 9 trinity people in Jesus name and watched 21 people come from a once trinity church in another state to be in our service that are now baptized in Jesus name. He watched another once trinity church group we baptized in Jesus name last year helping in the service…So dear ones criticism is easy and there will always be critics but getting solid word done for eternity is another story.

maybe a little off the subject...but good advice anyway...( Birds of like feathers fly together)

[Pragmatist]

Originally Posted by Carpenter

How on earth can you invite someone to church then tell them they have to drive 30-45 minutes to church three or more times per week? Personally, I wouldn't do that.

I totally agree with the above. And that is why we don't drive the minimum 45 minutes or longer to the "big" church. Plus, I actually prefer my small church and definitely prefer my pastor. It is sad, though, that there are many in the town where my church is located who do go to the big church instead, rather than reaching out in their own community.

[RevBuddy]

My experience in the Big Apple with calls inquiring about church was this...

"How big is your congregation?" "How many people are you running?" It is a continuing phenomena that people seem always interested in the number in the congregation and not the character or spirit of the assembly...sad really...

[Cindy]

Very insightful post as always Sis. Alvear.

[crakjak]

Sheep stealing???? Pastors' are thieves??? Good grief!!!

[LadyChocolate]

Sometimes they are crakjak...but more often than not, the sheep wander. Sometimes it really is time for people to move on... We were in a situation where it was time for us to move on and the pastor just would not let it happen... Pastors need to realize that. A real man of God told my hubby once, "sometimes, God sends a man to a city to make that city. Sometimes God sends a man to a city to make that man." That is how it was in our case. I honor the men of God who are willing to let their saints/ministry move on a do more for God.

Sometimes people just leave. They want more or want less. They always see greener grass on the other side. They are not being "proselyted," they are leaving. One thing you cannot do is "force" those people to stay. They will end up causing a whole lot of grief in a church.

When people leave, whether on a good note or not, God will always take care of that church.... as long as the pastor keeps walking with God! One man I know said that anytime saints left the church, God always sent new ones!!! Faith!

[Sam]

Originally Posted by crakjak

Sheep stealing???? Pastors' are thieves??? Good grief!!!

Who do the sheep belong to?

[Sister Alvear]

I am of the opinion everyone needs a home church and a pastor...people that run here and there will also run looking for every person that says they are Christ doing miracles on some street corner.

I used to think everone that appeared on my door step was sincere today I know lots just wanted a free handout...

In fact there are some things I will never do again...other things I will do differently. Lots of misfits appear and you help them from the goodness of your heart and as soon as they can stand on their on they stab you but always after they have used you.

Sam is right sheep belong to the Lord but the Lord himself gave us the story about sheep...they need a pastor.

Sheep (?) who will not listen are not sheep...sheep hear the voice of their pastor. And I am talking about a biblical pastor...not an abuser.

All pastores have had those who butter them up...beware...

Real sheep are precious and a real pastor will give his life for his sheep.

[Sister Alvear]

Sheep have to have a sheepfold or they just become wanderers...