Re: What Scripture Had The Most Profound Effect On
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timmy
I don't see any softening. I see the opposite, in Ex 14:4. "And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, that he shall follow after them; and I will be honoured upon Pharaoh, and upon all his host; that the Egyptians may know that I am the LORD. " And v 8. "And the LORD hardened the heart of Pharaoh king of Egypt, and he pursued after the children of Israel: and the children of Israel went out with an high hand."
Maybe I should actually read what we're talking about before trying to catch you in something...
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1 John 4:8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.
Re: What Scripture Had The Most Profound Effect On
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timmy
I guess this isn't what you were looking for, but one of the most important passages in my "deconversion" is Exodus. Take it literally or figuratively, either way, it doesn't portray God in a good light. In the story of the exodus, from beginning to end, we see a God who is childish, petty, unjust, dishonest, and just plain mean. He sets everything up as an excuse to show how powerful He is, and to become famous! (Look it up -- that's what God said.) He punishes Egyptian families, repeatedly and brutally, because of what Pharaoh did. And Pharaoh would have (says the story!) said Yes, if God hadn't hardened his heart. The request was for a three day's journey into the wilderness to offer sacrifices -- not to leave forever, which was the true intent: God told Moses to mislead.
IMO.
I still think you should read the book of Job again Timmy.
I do see what you're trying to say and the "irony" of so many things in scripture, like God hardening hearts, and creating evil, and so on...
And... Job had quite a few questions and objections himself. And he was justified no doubt in all his questions... But in the end, he realized, how can you fight against the one who created you? I mean, are you, yourself going to be able to change the mind of God with your questions?
Re: What Scripture Had The Most Profound Effect On
I think one of the eye opening scriptures for me was this one
Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: not of works, lest any man should boast.
This shoots the whole legalistic mindset out of the water. You can't be saved because of your works. You are saved and do works because of love and faith, but not for salvation. This was a real eye opener to me, as one who was coming out of one of the most legalistic OP churches. My works are not saving me. My faith in Jesus is, and my works are as a result of my faith, and not providing my salvation. What liberation to be free from the fear of man! To do works meet for and worthy of man stinks. But to live in faith, working because of love for Jesus, that is true salvation and true peace of mind!!
Re: What Scripture Had The Most Profound Effect On
Quote:
Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord
I still think you should read the book of Job again Timmy.
I do see what you're trying to say and the "irony" of so many things in scripture, like God hardening hearts, and creating evil, and so on...
And... Job had quite a few questions and objections himself. And he was justified no doubt in all his questions... But in the end, he realized, how can you fight against the one who created you? I mean, are you, yourself going to be able to change the mind of God with your questions?
Just a thought...
OK, I will reread it, and get back to you. No off-the-cuff reactions, this time.
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
Re: What Scripture Had The Most Profound Effect On
Quote:
Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord
And... Job had quite a few questions and objections himself. And he was justified no doubt in all his questions... But in the end, he realized, how can you fight against the one who created you? I mean, are you, yourself going to be able to change the mind of God with your questions?
Just a thought...
What struck me about the Job story is that EVEN SO . . .
That is to say, the experience of knowing GOD is so powerful that no matter what...Job's heart longed for God. Job truly kept God first in his life.
Re: What Scripture Had The Most Profound Effect On
This year (2012), the BOLDNESS as described in the following scripture from Acts 4 has a hold on me! May it spread!
29And now, Lord, behold their threatenings: and grant unto thy servants, that with all boldness they may speak thy word,
30By stretching forth thine hand to heal; and that signs and wonders may be done by the name of thy holy child Jesus.
31And when they had prayed, the place was shaken where they were assembled together; and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and they spake the word of God with boldness.
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"If this is going to be a Christian nation that doesn’t help the poor, either we’ve got to pretend that Jesus was just as selfish as we are, or we’ve got to acknowledge that he commanded us to love the poor and serve the needy without condition — and then admit that we just don’t want to do it."
-Steven Colbert