one-step doctrine - Page 3

mizpeh · #21 09-13-2007, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deltaguitar

I agree. What ever happened to putting our faith in the finished work of Christ? I was UPC for 27 years and only during the last few years did I hear teaching on the Cross of Christ.

I am not an expert but if we can save ourselves what is the point of the Cross.

How do we save ourselves if water baptism is for remission of sins? How are we able to remit sins or wash away our sins when we are baptised in water in Jesus name if only the blood of Christ can make us white as snow? Acts 2:38, Acts 22:16 My point is WE don't do a work when we are baptized, the Spirit of God does the work. Rom 2:28-29, Col 2:11-12, 1 Cor 12:13

Prov 20:9 Who can say, I have made my heart clean, I am pure from my sin?

mizpeh · #22 09-13-2007, 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stmatthew

If we see Jesus as the pattern, we have no problem understanding that Death, Burial, and resurrection is the only way to gain "NEW LIFE".

We also have no problem seeing baptism is not just a likeness of the burial of Christ but a true freedom from sin when the body of sin is removed through the blood of Christ. That's why it is called a circumcision not made with hands.

RevDWW · #23 09-13-2007, 08:57 PM

Rom 8:11 (KJV) But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

Can a person really be "saved" without the indwelling of the Spirit. It's the Spirit living in us that brings life and hope of the life to come.

What does it mean to be quickened in this context?

Jack Shephard · #24 09-13-2007, 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stmatthew

If we see Jesus as the pattern, we have no problem understanding that Death, Burial, and resurrection is the only way to gain "NEW LIFE".

This is a common argument from 3-steppers. "Follow the model" etc. The question I have is that Jesus was the flesh of God then why did he complete the three steps? He had to because He was still flesh. But He purchased our salvation on calvary. There is as much shown in the Bible for receiving Christ as there is three steps. I was a three stepper for a long time. The truth is that the three steps should be your goal, but I do not think God will ........ anyone if they did not complete them all, but I am not God.

stmatthew · #25 09-13-2007, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JTULLOCK

This is a common argument from 3-steppers. "Follow the model" etc. The question I have is that Jesus was the flesh of God then why did he complete the three steps? He had to because He was still flesh. But He purchased our salvation on calvary. There is as much shown in the Bible for receiving Christ as there is three steps. I was a three stepper for a long time. The truth is that the three steps should be your goal, but I do not think God will ........ anyone if they did not complete them all, but I am not God.

If you understand the old testament, which Christ fulfilled, you would realize that Jesus may have shed his blood on Calvary, but until that blood was taken into the holiest of all in the heavenlies and offered upon the mercy seat, and accepted by God, there was no pardon.

But lets not mistake pardon for sins as new birth, as new birth does not occur without the quickening of the Spirit which occurred at the "resurrection".

Scott Hutchinson · #26 09-13-2007, 09:41 PM

While I do believe it is God's will for all people to repent,get baptized in Jesus Name unto the remission of sins ,be Spirit filled and live a Holy Lifestyle,the question remains can we as human beings provide justfication from our sins by something that is within us as human beings ,or is Jesus Christ the only one that can provide a release from our sinful condition ?

Sam · #27 09-13-2007, 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stmatthew

If you understand the old testament, which Christ fulfilled, you would realize that Jesus may have shed his blood on Calvary, but until that blood was taken into the holiest of all in the heavenlies and offered upon the mercy seat, and accepted by God, there was no pardon.
...
.

not trying to hijack this thread but just wondering.
When do you think Jesus presented the blood to the Father in the heavenly tabernacle? Between the time when he told Mary to not touch Him because He was going to ascend to the Father (John 20:17) and later that day when He appeared to some disciples and showed them His wounds and breathed into them the Spirit of life for the New Covenant (John 20:19-23)? Or after that but before He told Thomas to handle his wounds a week later (John 20:26-29)? Or some other time?

Steve Epley · #28 09-13-2007, 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mizpeh

Regenerated means born again. I believe we are regenerated by the baptisms...the baptism of the Spirit and and baptism of water. Acts 2:38

Tit 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

Is this what you mean by sacramental regeneration, Dan?

Pull the Book on Baptist Dan will you?

stmatthew · #29 09-13-2007, 11:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam

not trying to hijack this thread but just wondering.
When do you think Jesus presented the blood to the Father in the heavenly tabernacle? Between the time when he told Mary to not touch Him because He was going to ascend to the Father (John 20:17) and later that day when He appeared to some disciples and showed them His wounds and breathed into them the Spirit of life for the New Covenant (John 20:19-23)? Or after that but before He told Thomas to handle his wounds a week later (John 20:26-29)? Or some other time?

I personally believe he ascended after seeing Mary, and prior to seeing the disciples, but I am not sure the bible is real specific when, so it is only a guess. But I do believe he offered that blood prior to any sins being forgiven under the new covenant.

Sherri · #30 09-13-2007, 11:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam

not trying to hijack this thread but just wondering.
When do you think Jesus presented the blood to the Father in the heavenly tabernacle? Between the time when he told Mary to not touch Him because He was going to ascend to the Father (John 20:17) and later that day when He appeared to some disciples and showed them His wounds and breathed into them the Spirit of life for the New Covenant (John 20:19-23)? Or after that but before He told Thomas to handle his wounds a week later (John 20:26-29)? Or some other time?

Sam, this question sounds way too TRINITARIAN to be dealt with on here!!!