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  #1  
Old 03-26-2009, 06:46 PM
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Scott Hutchinson Scott Hutchinson is offline
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The Scriptures Messianic Bible ?

I was given a copy of This Bible recently has anybody here ever read it ?
It seems to suggest that Jesus is a name of a Greek diety.
Is anybody here familiar with this translation ?
http://www.isr-messianic.org/pubs/the_scriptures.shtml
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Old 03-26-2009, 07:25 PM
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Re: The Scriptures Messianic Bible ?

I have no idea who this group is or what their Bible is.
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Old 03-26-2009, 07:33 PM
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Re: The Scriptures Messianic Bible ?

Seems strange looking at the book of Matthew in English and scattered throughout is a name in Hebrew letters. I wonder why they did not just call Him Yeshua and use English letters like the rest of the text. That's what the CJB (Complete Jewish Bible) does. If our New Testament was written in Greek, as it is generally assumed it was, the name would have been Iesous in Greek letters. That's the way the name Yeshua for both Jesus our Lord and Joshua the successor to Moses would have been written. I'm sure Paul and others did not write everything in Greek and then when they came to the name Iesous they would write it in Hebrew characters.
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Last edited by Sam; 03-26-2009 at 07:33 PM. Reason: correct typo
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Old 03-26-2009, 08:12 PM
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Re: The Scriptures Messianic Bible ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson View Post
I was given a copy of This Bible recently has anybody here ever read it ?
It seems to suggest that Jesus is a name of a Greek diety.
Is anybody here familiar with this translation ?
http://www.isr-messianic.org/pubs/the_scriptures.shtml
That "Greek deity" thing is a rhubarb. Of course, no one in Galilee pronounced His name as "Geez-us" - but the name thing is a bit odd.

I see that this group is from South Africa. There was a group from South Africa that infiltrated the Pentecostal Publishing House once back in the 1980's and inserted a tract titled "The Case of the Missing 'J'" into just about every book in the bookstore. That was kind of a funny prank- but tedious to be undone.

They are correct (sort of) about the pronunciation and all; but their conspiracy theory around the "J" and "Geez-us" simply isn't true. Languages change and sounds and syllables are imported, changed and dropped all of the time.

The problem is really far too complex to attribute to some conspiracy or pagan infiltration. It begins with the way that names and words are inflected in the Greek language. Thus we can have "Yeshua" become "Iesous" in Greek (using a common transliteration).

But as "Jesus" is involved in different actions, the Greek language will inflect the last syllable to show what part of the sentence His name (and His role) is intended to be. Such as, is He doing something? Or is He passive or perhaps receiving the action of a verb?

ιησουν (IESOUN) is "Jesus" receiving action. Peter is coming to Jesus in Matthew 14:29.

ιησους (IESOUS) is "Jesus" as the subject of the sentence in Matthew 4:1.

The Greek language will wreck havoc on those who demand to be overly literal in all of their communications. Didn't Matthew just "change" the name of our Lord in the examples above?

We get the "J" and thus the "Geez-us" from the way that Greek and Latin filtered through German and into English. In German the "J" is almost always spoken as a "Y" sound like in "Jah" (YAW) or "Yes." For whatever reason, when the Anglos and many of the the Saxons broke away from the Fatherland and migrated to Britannica their language evolved differently than the German in Germany.

(Just to add to the problem... no "German" would ever call his home "Germ-man-ee." It's Deustchland. The French called it Allemande and the English just make it worse ).

Given the way languages evolve, how can we even be certain that His name was pronounced exactly the way an Ashkenazim Jewish rabbi from L'vov pronounces "Joshua" today? That's what the "sacred name" sects like this one demand of us. It's really just another form of bigotry. And like all bigots, they just need to lighten up and let "I AM" be Whoever He wants to be.
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Old 03-26-2009, 09:45 PM
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Re: The Scriptures Messianic Bible ?

In my 1611 King James Bible, Jesus is spelt "Iesus" because the letter "J" wasn't in use back then.
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Old 03-26-2009, 10:11 PM
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Re: The Scriptures Messianic Bible ?

Shall we try another round?
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Old 03-26-2009, 10:14 PM
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Re: The Scriptures Messianic Bible ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam View Post
In my 1611 King James Bible, Jesus is spelt "Iesus" because the letter "J" wasn't in use back then.
How did the word "James" appear on the cover of the original King James Bibles?
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Old 03-26-2009, 10:25 PM
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Re: The Scriptures Messianic Bible ?

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Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple View Post
Shall we try another round?
I guess I missed the last. My soul sleeps a bit more and more as I grow older. Whattaugot?
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Old 03-26-2009, 11:22 PM
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Re: The Scriptures Messianic Bible ?

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Originally Posted by pelathais View Post
How did the word "James" appear on the cover of the original King James Bibles?
It does not appear in the original. The 1611 version is dedicated to IAMES.
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Old 03-26-2009, 11:39 PM
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Re: The Scriptures Messianic Bible ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple View Post
It does not appear in the original. The 1611 version is dedicated to IAMES.
Sorry... I was being TIC. Sams seems out of sorts lately. I was kind of picking at him.

Actually nothing appears on the cover itself. And you are right about the dedication and the "I" in "James" or "Iames." They had a different alphabet in 1611. No "W" either. And the "H" was a relatively recent addition from the Greek where it had an entirely different purpose as the letter eta which gave the "short" "e" sound.

I wish you could actually get paid for having accumulated this much useless information. To me it pretty fascinating. My wife thinks I need to talk to a doctor about it, though.
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