Holiness Is Still Important

proudfather · #1 05-25-2010, 09:05 AM

From what I've read on this website thus far, I cannot imagine that this will be a popular thread. Never the less, I will post it anyway, because I am concerned about the Apostolic movement.

This movement has let go of a lot of things that it used to stand for. While most preachers still believe Acts 2:38, the message of Holiness has become a touchy subject. I was surprised when ministers sat on Bro. Guy Godwin when he taught against ladies cutting their hair. I thought that was a given! After all, 1 Corinthians 11:14-16 is still in the Bible. I love the way the NLT translates this passage: "14 Isn’t it obvious that it’s disgraceful for a man to have long hair? 15 And isn’t long hair a woman’s pride and joy? For it has been given to her as a covering. 16 But if anyone wants to argue about this, I simply say that we have no other custom than this, and neither do God’s other churches."

I'm not sure why we're suddenly confused about this subject. Men that preached this for years are now backing down from their previous stance. Television was preached against in the 60s. How much more so should we preach against it today? Every time this issue is brought up on this site, the same argument is presented; "What is the difference between Television and Internet?" I agree that anyone can use the Internet for evil if they want to. The same goes for the Bible. Let me explain. I can take the book of Song of Solomon and allow my imagination to run wild on certain verses. I can even take certain passages in the Gospel's and twist them to fit what I believe. If a person is determined to sin, then he will find a way. The Bible defines sin this way in James 4:17, "17Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin."

So should we preach against all technology? Of course not! What we need to consider here, is are we allowing ourselves to be tempted beyond what we can bear? If a person has a problem with porn, they shouldn't use the internet without the proper filters. In fact, no one should use the internet without the proper filters. If you have a problem with lust, don't watch video's that will awaken those desires. Here's what I believe. Don't watch Hollywood...period. Whether it's on a Television screen, DVD player, the internet, exc. don’t watch it! Television however, cannot be controlled. I can hear your responses now. "I control mine." "I've never watched bad programs on my TV set." Let me ask you a question, and you'd better answer it honestly. Has your definition of "bad" changed at all since you purchased that TV?

Me and my wife attended a church that let down the standard for a while. We went out and bought some movies during this ordeal, and we started out innocently enough by watching Disney movies, PG films, exc. However, we started watching Star Trek, Star Wars, Batman movies and other PG-13 films. Before we knew it, we were watching R rated films because they only contained one bad scene or just a few cuss words. The Holy Ghost convicted me in prayer and even though the church I was attending didn't preach against it, I got rid of every DVD that I owned.

Sound extreme? Let me tell you that Heaven is cheap at any price. I am willing to give up anything and everything if Christ convicts me to do so. Television may seem ok on the surface, but in reality, it is moving your boundaries. If it was wrong 30 years ago, it is still wrong today. Paul said, “For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor." I wouldn't want to stand in the shoes of a compromiser on the Day of Judgment. Scripture tells us that teachers/ministers are subject to a stricter judgment. I don't know about you, but I want to be saved.

Now, I will quote the words of Job: "Suffer me that I may speak; and after that I have spoken, mock on."

You're probably thinking that I am about 50 years old, ignorant, and countrified. Well, you're wrong on two accounts. I am in my 20's and I grew up in the city. I am ignorant, but God will use the unlearned to preach this Gospel. I am trying to learn more about him every day. I pray that I might know Him, in the power of the real Holy Ghost.

Hoovie · #2 05-25-2010, 09:14 AM

I am likely about as conservative as yourself in practice, but you are in fact reading "uncut" into the text... and the Song of Solomon is a far cry from internet porn... DVD's? pretty much old technology now... digital computer downloads are fast replacing other media entertainment.

I would have guessed you as young and inexperienced - ignorant of extended life experience. Sorry.

mfblume · #3 05-25-2010, 09:34 AM

Uncut is no more long than 25 is old.

If long = uncut, then men can have hair way down their backs so long as they trim it.

proudfather · #4 05-25-2010, 09:36 AM

Hmmm...interesting. So now we have reduced ourselves to picking on someone's age.

1 Timothy 4:12 (King James Version)

12Let no man despise thy youth; but be thou an example of the believers, in word, in conversation, in charity, in spirit, in faith, in purity.

TheLegalist · #5 05-25-2010, 09:39 AM

poor guy.... doesn't know all the junk that is about to hit him. Just as the Precog screams at Tom Cruise in the movie "Minority Report" right before they bust through the door.... RUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU UUN

*AQuietPlace* · #6 05-25-2010, 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by proudfather

Hmmm...interesting. So now we have reduced ourselves to picking on someone's age.

1 Timothy 4:12 (King James Version)

12Let no man despise thy youth; but be thou an example of the believers, in word, in conversation, in charity, in spirit, in faith, in purity.

You're the one who brought it up.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfblume

Uncut is no more long than 25 is old.

If long = uncut, then men can have hair way down their backs so long as they trim it.

What do you think of the point Bro. Blume made here? Can't you see the contradiction?

Also - if long means as long as it can get, why doesn't short mean as short as it can get?

*AQuietPlace* · #7 05-25-2010, 09:41 AM

Also - no one here will deny that holiness is important. The discussion comes from how to define holiness.

DAII · #8 05-25-2010, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by proudfather

From what I've read on this website thus far, I cannot imagine that this will be a popular thread. Never the less, I will post it anyway, because I am concerned about the Apostolic movement.

This movement has let go of a lot of things that it used to stand for. While most preachers still believe Acts 2:38, the message of Holiness has become a touchy subject. I was surprised when ministers sat on Bro. Guy Godwin when he taught against ladies cutting their hair. I thought that was a given! After all, 1 Corinthians 11:14-16 is still in the Bible. I love the way the NLT translates this passage: "14 Isn’t it obvious that it’s disgraceful for a man to have long hair? 15 And isn’t long hair a woman’s pride and joy? For it has been given to her as a covering. 16 But if anyone wants to argue about this, I simply say that we have no other custom than this, and neither do God’s other churches."

I'm not sure why we're suddenly confused about this subject. Men that preached this for years are now backing down from their previous stance. Television was preached against in the 60s. How much more so should we preach against it today? Every time this issue is brought up on this site, the same argument is presented; "What is the difference between Television and Internet?" I agree that anyone can use the Internet for evil if they want to. The same goes for the Bible. Let me explain. I can take the book of Song of Solomon and allow my imagination to run wild on certain verses. I can even take certain passages in the Gospel's and twist them to fit what I believe. If a person is determined to sin, then he will find a way. The Bible defines sin this way in James 4:17, "17Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin."

So should we preach against all technology? Of course not! What we need to consider here, is are we allowing ourselves to be tempted beyond what we can bear? If a person has a problem with porn, they shouldn't use the internet without the proper filters. In fact, no one should use the internet without the proper filters. If you have a problem with lust, don't watch video's that will awaken those desires. Here's what I believe. Don't watch Hollywood...period. Whether it's on a Television screen, DVD player, the internet, exc. don’t watch it! Television however, cannot be controlled. I can hear your responses now. "I control mine." "I've never watched bad programs on my TV set." Let me ask you a question, and you'd better answer it honestly. Has your definition of "bad" changed at all since you purchased that TV?

Me and my wife attended a church that let down the standard for a while. We went out and bought some movies during this ordeal, and we started out innocently enough by watching Disney movies, PG films, exc. However, we started watching Star Trek, Star Wars, Batman movies and other PG-13 films. Before we knew it, we were watching R rated films because they only contained one bad scene or just a few cuss words. The Holy Ghost convicted me in prayer and even though the church I was attending didn't preach against it, I got rid of every DVD that I owned.

Sound extreme? Let me tell you that Heaven is cheap at any price. I am willing to give up anything and everything if Christ convicts me to do so. Television may seem ok on the surface, but in reality, it is moving your boundaries. If it was wrong 30 years ago, it is still wrong today. Paul said, “For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor." I wouldn't want to stand in the shoes of a compromiser on the Day of Judgment. Scripture tells us that teachers/ministers are subject to a stricter judgment. I don't know about you, but I want to be saved.

Now, I will quote the words of Job: "Suffer me that I may speak; and after that I have spoken, mock on."

You're probably thinking that I am about 50 years old, ignorant, and countrified. Well, you're wrong on two accounts. I am in my 20's and I grew up in the city. I am ignorant, but God will use the unlearned to preach this Gospel. I am trying to learn more about him every day. I pray that I might know Him, in the power of the real Holy Ghost.

TV was never wrong .... content can be.

TheLegalist · #9 05-25-2010, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfblume

Uncut is no more long than 25 is old.

If long = uncut, then men can have hair way down their backs so long as they trim it.

come on Blume the foundational aspect of the whole is understood as covered and uncovered. You ignore the words context by doing such which is based on uncovered and covered. Want to argue against uncut fine but don't use that noncontextual agrument that defines the parameters.

TheLegalist · #10 05-25-2010, 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by *AQuietPlace*

Also - no one here will deny that holiness is important. The discussion comes from how to define holiness.

I would have to disagree. That is like or similar in part to the argument on baptism...

Baptism is not essential for salvation but all who are saved will be baptized

Holiness is not essential for salvation but all who are saved will be holy.

Then you have varying degrees on the above but I think you get the point.

I see this mentality on many boards.