Are others called to Pastor? - Page 8

Cindy · #71 10-07-2012, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titus2woman

I love you to pieces Cindy... but...

I completely disagree that any man can have any kind of an effective relationship with 200-300 people... ever. And I believe that this is why the early church was a small group model.

A person can bring a message to hundreds of thousands...(probably not on a weekly basis if he wants to do any kind of decent job) but relationship?... no way.

With today's technology I don't really see a problem with that. Not everyone needs him at the same time, usually. Maybe 200 should be the maximum.

Titus2woman · #72 10-07-2012, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cindy

With today's technology I don't really see a problem with that. Not everyone needs him at the same time, usually. Maybe 200 should be the maximum.

And herein lies the problem... For every person I know and love... they have kids, a husband, a mom and dad, brothers and sisters, neices and nephews, friends who are not my friends, etc. At most times nearly everyone has something in their lives that is stressing them...

Right now I personally have; grief issues over losing my mom recently. A son in jail, a brother headed to death row, a child custody battle in the family, and a brand new baby granddaughter who is sick with a bad cold. So just keeping up with my junk if you are my friend will keep you busy. And I have a pretty quiet life compared to many people I know. My marriage is solid, most my kids are doing great, there is no serious sickness in my family and no one terminally ill. We are all financially fine, have food, shelter, and even savings. And we know God.

200... no way....

houston · #73 10-07-2012, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titus2woman

Some things to think about... Maybe I jaded from living in Texas... So tell me what do you think about

Joel Olsteen
Ed Young
TD Jakes
Ed Young Jr
Kerry Shook
Jack Graham
Ira Hillard

Cause several of those fellows are almost in my backyard. And then we have televangelists and circuit preachers like Joyce Meyer, Creflo Dollar... oh heck, you get the point! How is that different? Many of them started out just like you describe. When does it become a problem exactly? Can a man really pastor 50 people... 100... 200...500...1,000... 5,000? It seems that everyone decides that 'just bigger than I am' is too big... yet everyone is trying to grow and no one ever voluntarily divides.

I don't doubt that you are sincere and that you are doing your best but do you see what is wrong with the system? My kid is in jail right now and I buried my mother in March. Managing to handle both of those life situations without a 'hired man' and so could anyone else. Many people have just been convinced that they can not... and that they can not 'make it' without a 'man of God'... nuts.

I mean if money is the measure of a pastor... This is the best we've got!

You didn't ask me... so...

Dordrecht · #74 10-07-2012, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AreYouReady?

I have to ask who decided that it was "the pastor's" job to sit with sick people all night?

Where is the biblical precedent?

Oh, man this is going nowhere!

I was in the hospital with a heart attack
the pastor and his wife came to visit me.

Where is THAT in the bible????

I can see where this is going.
All common sense is going out the
window here!

AreYouReady? · #75 10-07-2012, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dordrecht

Oh, man this is going nowhere!

I was in the hospital with a heart attack
the pastor and his wife came to visit me.

Where is THAT in the bible????

I can see where this is going.
All common sense is going out the
window here!

Any Holy Ghost filled saint should be just as effective praying with you as the hired hand called "the pastor". And as Holy Ghost filled, saints should have that love in them to want to come and be by a sick one's side. Now days they don't even bother to pick up a phone to see if one is ok when they miss church. They leave it up to the hired pastor, who doesn't have time because he is busy sitting with somebody else. Apparently you do not see this to be a problem.

Where is the common sense when people hire a man to do all the things you posted?

You don't get it dort. Christ's church isn't supposed to be about hired help coming to pray with you while you are sick. We...people...we all make up the body and share with love and support to the weak, the sick, the needy and yes, even the preaching. Some hirelings really do not care for the sheep because it is "their job" to visit them and say a little prayer when sick.

Christ talked about this in his parables.

Give me Biblical precedent that a pastor is supposed to do all that you listed as a "job" and I will shut up.

Cindy · #76 10-07-2012, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titus2woman

And herein lies the problem... For every person I know and love... they have kids, a husband, a mom and dad, brothers and sisters, neices and nephews, friends who are not my friends, etc. At most times nearly everyone has something in their lives that is stressing them...

Right now I personally have; grief issues over losing my mom recently. A son in jail, a brother headed to death row, a child custody battle in the family, and a brand new baby granddaughter who is sick with a bad cold. So just keeping up with my junk if you are my friend will keep you busy. And I have a pretty quiet life compared to many people I know. My marriage is solid, most my kids are doing great, there is no serious sickness in my family and no one terminally ill. We are all financially fine, have food, shelter, and even savings. And we know God.

200... no way....

But, that is where the elders of the church come in. The Pastor doesn't have to do it alone.

AreYouReady? · #77 10-07-2012, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cindy

But, that is where the elders of the church come in. The Pastor doesn't have to do it alone.

In this region, I've never seen the elders of the church do anything except go to the front when the pastor directs them to for altar call.

In some churches, the women weren't even allowed to get together to have a home bible study during the week.

I once talked about trying to start up a ladies prayer meeting in the church once a week. One lady said..."It isn't my place"....

KeptByTheWord · #78 10-07-2012, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AreYouReady?

Any Holy Ghost filled saint should be just as effective praying with you as the hired hand called "the pastor". And as Holy Ghost filled, saints should have that love in them to want to come and be by a sick one's side. Now days they don't even bother to pick up a phone to see if one is ok when they miss church. They leave it up to the hired pastor, who doesn't have time because he is busy sitting with somebody else. Apparently you do not see this to be a problem.

Where is the common sense when people hire a man to do all the things you posted?

You don't get it dort. Christ's church isn't supposed to be about hired help coming to pray with you while you are sick. We...people...we all make up the body and share with love and support to the weak, the sick, the needy and yes, even the preaching. Some hirelings really do not care for the sheep because it is "their job" to visit them and say a little prayer when sick.

Christ talked about this in his parables.

Give me Biblical precedent that a pastor is supposed to do all that you listed as a "job" and I will shut up.

Exactly! A body is not made up just of the "head" or the "feet"! It takes all parts of the body working together to function. And the head of this particular body, the church.............. is Christ... and NOT the pastor!

The pastor, preacher, teacher, evangelist, prophets and so on are all part of the BODY just like everyone else, from the janitor to the secretary to the choir director to the sunday school teacher. If all are not functioning together, working together... then the body isn't a body.

And that is why the church is so sickly today and so much distress on every hand. One person wants to call all the shots, show up for all the important events, get all the credit, and let the rest of the "body" do all the work, in many cases.

When in effect, if we all were acting as servants in the body with Christ being our head, our efforts would reach far greater than our minds could ever conceive!

Dordrecht · #79 10-07-2012, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Where is the common sense when people hire a man to do all the things you posted?

WHERE did I post all the things a pastor should do????????

Nowhere!

Quote:

You don't get it dort. Christ's church isn't supposed to be about hired help coming to pray with you while you are sick. We...people...we all make up the body and share with love and support to the weak, the sick, the needy and yes, even the preaching.

Yes, that's all fine and dandy but you and I both know
that in reality this does not come into practice in most
churches.

Anyhow, we keep disagreeing here till we see green and purple.
(I still love you guys even though I disagree!)

I believe a pastor should get a decent wage
for the work he's doing. The laborer deserves
a decent reward. End of story.
I am out of here.

AreYouReady? · #80 10-07-2012, 07:26 PM

Doesn't anybody else see that there is a problem when there are "special schools" to train "preachers"? Isn't the entire body of believers supposed to be receiving that special instruction during church services? Why are there separate *clergy* and *laity* classes of people? Didn't Christ command the Apostles to go out into the world and preach the gospel? Isn't that knowledge supposed to be handed down to every believer? And every believer teach and preach to new believers?