Seriously, some of this is reflective of past churches and leadership. Generally, I ignore it, but this was really over the top in how the point of view was even expressed. I just thought, Wow, are you kidding? You can't back that up and you are expressing your view that strongly? I think that's when I can get annoyed.
Oh, and you will love this one. "Godly sorrow has nothing to do with repentance." I said, "But, the Bible says that it does. II Cor 7:10 says, 'For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation'. Worketh in the Greek means 'accomplishes'. So, you would be saying, 'Godly sorrow accomplishes repentance."
You know what the reply was? "I don't like that translation." Hahahahahahaha!
I said, "None of the other translations say it any other way."
Trying to figure out what in the world is going on. LOL!
Do you really need to be around these people?
__________________ "all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed."
~Declaration of Independence
__________________ "all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed."
~Declaration of Independence
my personal experience is that people who spiritualize everything simply cannot be argued with. they will just decide you have a devil too.
The fact is the bible doesn't even come close to making the suggestion that Paul had a devil.
He did have issues. He SAID he had issues... in fact his Damascus Road experience did not stop him from having issues.... It was the GRACE of God that helped Paul with his issues.
Im with Brother Benincasa. Im not sure why one needs to subject themselves to nonsense....
and suggesting that Godly Sorrow has nothing to do with repentance is about as close to heresy as one can get.
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
my personal experience is that people who spiritualize everything simply cannot be argued with. they will just decide you have a devil too.
The fact is the bible doesn't even come close to making the suggestion that Paul had a devil.
He did have issues. He SAID he had issues... in fact his Damascus Road experience did not stop him from having issues.... It was the GRACE of God that helped Paul with his issues.
Im with Brother Benincasa. Im not sure why one needs to subject themselves to nonsense....
and suggesting that Godly Sorrow has nothing to do with repentance is about as close to heresy as one can get.
And no one actually cared this was taught. The person teaching got mad when I challenged him on it. He said, "Sister, you are taking this too far." I just put up my hand and walked off - talk to the hand. He followed me still talking - about nothing that made sense. He must pay a LOT of tithes to keep that position. OOps, did I say that out loud?!! LOL!
my personal experience is that people who spiritualize everything simply cannot be argued with. they will just decide you have a devil too.
Wanted to come back and read this again - GREAT point and TRUE!
Quote:
The fact is the bible doesn't even come close to making the suggestion that Paul had a devil.
He did have issues. He SAID he had issues... in fact his Damascus Road experience did not stop him from having issues.... It was the GRACE of God that helped Paul with his issues.
There is the teacher in you - Good stuff! I want to remember this. I think Mizpeh would like that last paragraph!
If what Saul of Tarsus did pre-conversion can be attributed to the devil, then the "devil made me do it" excuse starts to carry weight.
But if we can imagine that even murder is a work of the flesh, suddenly, how horribly humans can be WITHOUT a devil, terrifies. That is too much for some.
However, he that sinneth is of the devil, as 1 John 3 reads, and so, since Saul was definitely in sin, I suppose an argument could be made...though not enough to convince anyone that Saul was possessed; rather, that Saul, in the flesh, was subject to the wiles of the devil, just like anyone else who isn't regenerated from above.
I've been thinking about this verse in I John 3. I am not certain it is saying, "subject to the wiles of the devil", but rather, if you do these things you are "imitating" or "resembling" the devil.
Like you said above, it startles us to suddenly find that our flesh is horrible WITHOUT the devil.
I believe that Saul/Paul was acting as he thought he should - defending the Law of Moses against heresy, and I don't believe that had anything to do with the devil.
11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
Amen! That's one of those scriptures that could make you feel bad, if you happen to find yourself admonished by it, thinking God whooped up on you, when He actually wants to only save you. Just my additional thought on that. lol
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