My Take On Illegal Immigration

[SDG]

This country is safer than he got it under a philandering President that let Osama plan for 9/11 .... every president since Franklin Roosevelt's New Deal can be pinned for the GREATEST EXPANSION OF THE FEDERAL GOV'T EVER ..... BUREAUCRACY IS A LIBERAL PLAGUE ...

Even Reagan was said to have expanded gov't ... you must look at the numbers of gov't spending not just in total dollars ...

Bush is an American patriot who has told our enemies we will not tolerate threats to our nation.

[chaotic_resolve]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

I would never stand by exploitation ... that's why I'm calling for an amnesty and securing the border .. this would phase in illegals ... allow them to at least earn the minimum ... and help our dying Social Security system while making our borders safe..

SS system has been dying for decades. It's nothing new and there's no amount of amnesty that will save it.

The problem even with the current Amnesty bill is that it barely imposes any penalty for breaking the simple rule of law.

The bill says the Head of the Household must return to their native land to file for this amnesty . . . yet groups are already complaining about that.

The bill makes them pay $5,000 (I believe) plus unpaid taxes . . . and already Democrats and others are saying it's too much.

So what's being said by Democrats and these groups, is that the amnesty should be given free and unconditionally.

And we wonder why people don't take the law seriously?

I have no problem with giving ILLEGALs the opportunity to become citizens . . . just not with free and unconditional amnesty.

[SDG]

Adding a pool of millions of new contributers that will pay into SS for the foreseeable future would not help ... you're bugging.

[chaotic_resolve]

Whoa! I'm going to be late for visitation and outreach! I'll be back to school you on immigration and why Bush is bad for America a little while later, DA. *grin*

j/k

It's been fun . . . be back later this evening.

[SDG]

So much on flip-flopping on Bush on my part ... CR ... huh ...????

It seems to me that the media has affected your perception of him... I'm almost sure you said you voted for him, twice?.

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Then you and Daniel need to touch bases here. He is claiming study after study shows that amnesty will INCREASE Tax revenue...something is wrong with this picture.

There has to be a reason the feds will not enforce the laws on the books. I remember in the 70's and the 80's, the INS would regularly round up the illegals off of construction sites. Even small operations not just Wal-Mart, for political expediency.

[King's Child]

I know a place where they hire lots of illegal immigrants. One day one worker told another worker want to bet I can shut down this plant. So they bet. Then suddenly the worker hollered out that INS was here. They didn't have enough people left to run the plant so they had to shut down for the rest of the day. He won his bet. (Would have got fired it they had found out who had started this) LOL

[Brett Prince]

I am suprised at both sides here.

CS, once again, you prove yourself as a man of superlative quality. Even in a disagreement where I know you have major emotions, you speak respectfully and carefully.

[Ferd]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

Secure the border ... phase those that are illegal in ... help solve our Social Security mess while we're at it ... or you will have paid into SSI for naught ....

I agree with much of your position but I do think there is some flaw in your understanding.

Currently there are between 12 and 25 million illegal immagrants in this country. The majority of those currently in this country illegally are working poor. if they are legalized, they will immediatly qualify for many government services. Already these people cost the US billions in unrepaid medical bills and un insured motorists claims on insurance.

legalizing these people will not change the costs downward. You have said that getting their SSN dollars will be a good thing. that isnt exactly correct. While they will pay SS taxes, this really isnt a net gain. while they may pay a small amount in (small because they earn little), that will be more than offset by two factors. first, they will recieve more dollars in government programs. secondly, in retirement, studies show, they will return to their country of orrigin in pretty large numbers thus the SSN dollars will be spent some place other than the USA.

the net will be a massive tax burden to middle class and above.

additionally while there are 12 to 25 million illegals in this country, every one will be able to bring others here to be with them. Parents (no matter how old) and children will be able to come legally. so 12 to 25 million people becomes almost 50 million and 75 to 80 % of that number will qualify for extensive government services. 25 million that get an average of $100 per month (that is way low ball) is 2.5 BILLION dollars per month in new government services. their taxes will not off set that.

we do need to first secure the boarder. then and only then move forward with figuring out what to do with immagration.

[Thad]

Did you all Hear what happend today ??
Terroist were plotting to blow up JFK airport???

They catch 150,000 illegals coming over from the
Mexican border a Year BUUUUT!!! Aprox. I million or
more get over!! AND!!! This includes north Koreans,
Iranians, algerians, etc etc WHY?? because word has gotton
out all over the world how easy it is to get through our
Porous borders.