Gender Laws Forced on Churches?

[votivesoul]

Originally Posted by Esaias

But on topic here, any state church, ie a 501(c)3 incorporated 'non profit' WILL bow the knee to Baal, or be sued into oblivion, the way things are going. And they should be. You cannot serve two masters.

Very much right!

Imagine a church, meeting house to house, the Bible way, with the only bathroom in the home a gender neutral bathroom, room for one at a time, and suddenly, the issue evaporates.

[n david]

Now we've been chastised that we should accommodate sin and perversion, why stop there? Churches should create smoking areas and look the other way when a pedophile goes around playing tickle games with Sunday school kids. Do not make sinners and perverts uncomfortable!

In fact, that message about sin and hell...it's gotta go. We want to use positive messages to try and help love-win them to Jesus.

Sorry, but if a deviant and mentally perverted man comes into church and wants to use the ladies restroom, just as I wouldn't accommodate sin, I wouldn't accommodate his perversion.

My :twocents

[Godsdrummer]

Really did you even read Votives post? You already accommodate most sin in the church, and just look a blind eye to it.

That is a debatable subject anyway, yet churches still promote gluttony and that is just as much sin as smoking. Common get real.

You already do that, and think it is just cute, most don't recognize a pedophile until they get caught, and then many times it is the pastor.

Do not make sinners and perverts uncomfortable!

There are already sinners and perverts that are comfortable in the churches, and they are comfortable because their sin is in hidden, but just let someone that their sin is blatant and lets make them uncomfortable?

What did Jesus do?

Part of the problem here is classing the transgender in the same class as a deviant, or mentally pervert. A transgender is not interested in your wife or daughter, as they identify as a women, and most time you would not know they were transgender. The ones you have to worry about are the deviant and perverts, but most times they look just like just what they look like a man or women.

Just my two cents worth.

[n david]

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

You already accommodate most sin in the church, and just look a blind eye to it.

No, I don't.

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

That is a debatable subject anyway, yet churches still promote gluttony and that is just as much sin as smoking. Common get real.

Never heard of a church which "promoted gluttony." That's not to say there aren't gluttons. I'm sure you either are one now or have been one in the past. Lord knows I loved to eat as a teenager. But sure, let's stock the church bookstore with cigarettes and the finest Cuban cigars. Oh, and some pipes for the hipsters.

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

You already do that, and think it is just cute, most don't recognize a pedophile until they get caught, and then many times it is the pastor.

Absolutely false. I do NOT look the other way and think it's cute when an adult molests a child! Where do you come up with this tripe? I've called a man out for it before and would do so again. Are there some who hide their sins, sure. But I have not and would not "turn a blind eye" or "think it's cute."

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

There are already sinners and perverts that are comfortable in the churches, and they are comfortable because their sin is in hidden, but just let someone that their sin is blatant and lets make them uncomfortable?

If sinners and perverts are comfortable in your church, I'd look for a new church. And if someone wants to blatantly broadcast and push their sin in the church, they should be turned away. Sorry if that offends your seeker friendly feelings.

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

What did Jesus do?

He didn't accommodate sin. I don't believe he would have sat in the living room while Mary Magdalene was meeting men in the bedroom.

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

Part of the problem here is classing the transgender in the same class as a deviant, or mentally pervert. A transgender is not interested in your wife or daughter, as they identify as a women, and most time you would not know they were transgender. The ones you have to worry about are the deviant and perverts, but most times they look just like just what they look like a man or women.

It's a mental illness. Regardless of whether or not they're interested in my wife or daughter, a person born a man should use the men's room and a person born a woman should use the woman's room.

[consapente89]

Originally Posted by votivesoul

Perhaps not. But let me throw out a scenario.

An avid soulwinner from an Apostolic church, makes friends with a transgendered person at work. He or she, as the case may be, is determined to win this person to the Lord.

The soulwinner prays, interecedes, travails, and fasts, being a light and loving friend to the transgendered person.

Finally, a chance to really talk with the transgendered person comes around. They have a wonderful conversation about the Lord and His goodness. The Gospel is mentioned. An invitation to the soulwinner's church is given.

The transgendered person accepts, thinking that if this kind, warmhearted and loving person is what a true Christian is, then his/her church must be just the same.

The transgendered attends on a Sunday morning. He or she attempts to use the restroom per the gender of choice. Someone sees it, reports it to an usher, the usher tells the pastor, and the pastor tells the usher to clear the foyer and wait (or worse, go in) for the transgender to come out.

A scene is made, the usher isn't as kind, warmhearted, and loving a person as the soulwinner/coworker. Or maybe so, but is just following orders. Or maybe so, but just isn't up to speed on all the politically correct lingo, and offense is made. The transgender is:

1.) Told to leave the building for the safety of whichever gender

2.) Allowed to stay for the service, but warned that he or she must use the appropriate restroom next time, or he/she won't be welcome back

3.) Nothing is said, but the transgender person is then subtly escorted and followed by the usher for the rest of the meeting, while a quiet word is sent throughout the church so that husbands can protect wives, mothers can protect children, and etc. The transgendered person then of course, realizes what's going on, even though no one has said a thing.

If allowed, he or she stays for the rest of the service, out of courtesy for the soulwinner coworker.

Afterward, heart hardened, feeling hurt and embarrassed, the transgendered person never wants to step foot into an Apostolic Church again.

He or she closes him/herself off from the Gospel. The avid soulwinner can't make a dent.

And for what?

For straining at a gnat while swallowing a camel?

For forgetting the weightier matters of the law?

This scenario is not intended to mean that transgendered people don't need to repent, or that we should coddle them in their sin.

But the Gospel is more important than where a person relieves themselves.

Accommodation, to me, is like an olive branch that let's a transgendered person, who doesn't know his/her right hand from his/her left, who is dead in trespasses, and already condemned, know that he or she can come to a meeting without being judged, harassed, ridiculed, or whatever, and that he or she is then free to experience the presence of God, hear the Word of the Lord proclaimed and heralded, and make a choice to give his or her heart to Jesus, without restraint, and without the church interfering simply because of what restroom he or she went into before service began.

That, to me, is way more important.

Romans 13:14 "Make no provision for the flesh"

[Esaias]

Your body has an immune system. When the immune system is working, it has a zero tolerance policy for pathogens. When your immune system begins tolerating pathogens, you basically have an immune deficiency syndrome. And you will die unless you get your immunity back.

Societies are the same way. Whether a nation, or a church, they must have a zero tolerance policy towards sin and things that are destructive to the society. Otherwise, they WILL die, sooner or later, of infection.

The "transgender issue" is a forced issue created and promoted by people who are trying - intentionally - to destroy both the nation and the church.

Unfortunately, a lot of people have had their immune system compromised.

[aegsm76]

GD - so you are ok with the government telling churches what preachers can say in a service?

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by votivesoul

And in case anyone thinks I'm just being philosophical, less than two months ago, a transgendered young man, who was trying to pass as a woman, recently went to an Apostolic Church here in my state, a few hours north of me, and wrote a long testimony of how God changed his life and how the ministry and leadership of said Church helped him realize who the man is that God wants him to become, because they didn't pass judgment, or demonstration any recalcitrance toward him being there in a dress, with makeup and jewelry on.

The fellow repented of his sin, and shared it all on Facebook, with before and after pics for all to see.

Since the person posted this on Facebook, can you provide a link?

[shazeep]

ya!

Originally Posted by consapente89

Romans 13:14 "Make no provision for the flesh"

yes, but that is for you, personally.

Put On Christ

11Besides this, knowing the time, it is already the hourq for your to wake up from sleep,s for now our salvation is nearer than when we first believed.t 12The night is nearly over, and the daylight is near,u so let us discard the deeds of darknessv and put on the armor of light.w 13Let us •walk with decency,x as in the daylight: not in carousing and drunkenness;y not in sexual impurity and promiscuity; not in quarreling and jealousy. 14But put on the Lord Jesus Christ,z and make no plans to satisfy the fleshly desires.aa

this is not a directive to enforce upon others, wadr.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Since the person posted this on Facebook, can you provide a link?

I can't find anything on Facebook that corresponds to what what was stated, can someone provide a link?

Also, what church was this?