Daniel's 70th week

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

What is the alternative? Christ already came? The resurrection already happened?

Mike? Is it just me? Or do you really stink at what you do?

Forget Mike, because he will never answer the hard questions. The Bible to him (as far as eschatology) is to be cherry picked. Daniel 11 is turned on its head. By the time you get to 12, he injects his own ideas (of what he was ecclesiastically nursed on in Dispensationalism) into the narrative. By the time you come up with the king of the north and the king of the south, he dissipates into the walls. He honestly doesn't have the slightest idea. If this was Trinitarian verses One God, or to beard or not to beard he would burn down an entire thread, page after page. Listen, if there was no such thing as the internet, social media, civilian access to YouTubes, Mike would be alone.

He would be known as the creepy old religious guy up the block. The one that found a burlap bag shirt at a yard sale and decided to street preach in it.
Thinking it was "sackcloth?"

Mike, alternatives? We aren't making a plan to go to Orlando, and figuring out our options. I'm asking you questions. Since you are RIGHT, since you are PERFECT, then YOU should be able to spoon feed me.

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Dom,

To YOU verse 7 does not seem to be referring to verses 1-3. But to ME thats just what it seems to be pointing to! The time of trouble in the time when the man of sin comes into the glorious land. Verse 7 SEEMS to be referring to the time of his reign when he scatters the power of the holy people.



How about in the glorious land of Israel?

Daniel 12:41-45

41He shall enter also into the glorious land, and many countries shall be overthrown: but these shall escape out of his hand, even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon. 42He shall stretch forth his hand also upon the countries: and the land of Egypt shall not escape. 43But he shall have power over the treasures of gold and of silver, and over all the precious things of Egypt: and the Libyans and the Ethiopians shall be at his steps. 44But tidings out of the east and out of the north shall trouble him: therefore he shall go forth with great fury to destroy, and utterly to make away many. 45And he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious holy mountain; yet he shall come to his end, and none shall help him.

Jesus spoke of the desolation of Jerusalem:

Luke 21:20-24

20And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. 21Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto. 22For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. 23But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people. 24And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

THE TIMES OF THE GENTILES......is the time, times, and a half the angel mentions to Daniel in chapter 12:7

7And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

All this is in some far off future? Including Luke 21:20-24? That would necessitate a rebuilt temple complete with working legitimate priesthood?
Please prove this with book, chapter, and verse.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Mike? Is it just me? Or do you really stink at what you do?

Forget Mike, because he will never answer the hard questions. The Bible to him (as far as eschatology) is to be cherry picked. Daniel 11 is turned on its head. By the time you get to 12, he injects his own ideas (of what he was ecclesiastically nursed on in Dispensationalism) into the narrative. By the time you come up with the king of the north and the king of the south, he dissipates into the walls. He honestly doesn't have the slightest idea. If this was Trinitarian verses One God, or to beard or not to beard he would burn down an entire thread, page after page. Listen, if there was no such thing as the internet, social media, civilian access to YouTubes, Mike would be alone.

He would be known as the creepy old religious guy up the block. The one that found a burlap bag shirt at a yard sale and decided to street preach in it.
Thinking it was "sackcloth?"

Mike, alternatives? We aren't making a plan to go to Orlando, and figuring out our options. I'm asking you questions. Since you are RIGHT, since you are PERFECT, then YOU should be able to spoon feed me.

Dom,

With you there is no discussion of ideas. You DEMAND answers to a never ending array of questions. I have been asking you to lay out your belief in a short concise manner for several years and you have never none done it. Just more evasion and name calling. I have to assume you are ashamed of it.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Dom,

With you there is no discussion of ideas. You DEMAND answers to a never ending array of questions. I have been asking you to lay out your belief in a short concise manner for several years and you have never none done it. Just more evasion and name calling. I have to assume you are ashamed of it.

But I have Mike, I have laid out what I believe for years. Going all the way back to my discussions with Mike Wiltcher, and Elder Blume. Where were you Mike? Oh, I remember, I started a thread just for you, and your teaching which you titled "Two Witness Prophets, The Man Child Ministry" in the eschatology section. When asked questions by the group, you opted out. With the same sorry foolishness you always do. I guess only in threads concerning to beard or not to beard, is when you spend huge man hours.
Or, if we let you ramble on in your made up Hebrew as you create names for Jesus.

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Hi Dom,

I just noticed this thread for the first time. It might have been a powerful discussion but it looks as tho since you guys have it all figured out there would not be much point amen?

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

I have to assume you are ashamed of it.

Mike, look through this thread (anyone) you will notice that you ran from my questions. Mike, you became mist and wafted off. I kept repostring my question. No, you are ashamed, that you are a cherry picker eschatologist. Forgive me those who are really eschatologists, whether they are futurists, dispensationalists or historicists, pre, mid, or a mills. No, Mike, you get my special attention because you are the teacher, you have made yourself thus, and therefore you should have the chutzpah to be able to defend yourself concerning what you state emphatically as being 100% correct. But, I have read your material for many years, 18? 20? Lot of time, but what I gathered is that you are a talking head, someone who goes unchallenged in his living room. If the discussion gets too hot, you flick the switch. You want what I believe? I've given it, but what I find surprisingly there is virtually nothing here of what you believe. You post some verses and tell us look here it is? Immediately after the tribulation, there will be the greatest tribulation there has ever been, blah, blah, blah?

I asked you good questions, kept them down to a slow roar, but you are a fake. All you care about is your YouTube, PalTalk, and whatever house wives from Fort Lauderdale can be sucked up by your song and dance.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Dom,

To YOU verse 7 does not SEEM to be referring to verses 1-3. But to ME thats just what it SEEMS to be pointing to! The time of trouble in the time when the man of sin comes into the glorious land.

Verse 7 SEEMS to be referring to the time of his reign when he scatters the power of the holy people.



How about in the glorious land of Israel?

Daniel 12:41-45

41He shall enter also into the glorious land, and many countries shall be overthrown: but these shall escape out of his hand,

even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon

. 42He shall stretch forth his hand also upon the countries: and the land of Egypt shall not escape. 43But he shall have power over the treasures of gold and of silver, and over all the precious things of Egypt: and the Libyans and the Ethiopians shall be at his steps. 44But tidings out of the east and out of the north shall trouble him: therefore he shall go forth with great fury to destroy, and utterly to make away many. 45And he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious

holy

mountain; yet he shall come to his end, and none shall help him.

Jesus spoke of the desolation of Jerusalem:

Luke 21:20-24

20And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. 21Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto. 22For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. 23But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people. 24And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

THE TIMES OF THE GENTILES......is the time, times, and a half the angel mentions to Daniel in chapter 12:7

7And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when

he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

All this is in some far off future? Including Luke 21:20-24? That would necessitate a rebuilt temple complete with working legitimate priesthood?
Please prove this with book, chapter, and verse.

Mike, how many holy people do you have today? Last time I checked it is only those who have the HOLY GHOST baptized in JESUS NAME. Is Luke 21:20-24 is in the future?

And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the DESOLATION thereof is NIGH.

Then let them which are in Judæa flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto. For these be the DAYS OF VENGEANCE, that ALL THINGS WHICH ARE WRITTEN MAY BE FULFILLED.

But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in THE LAND (not the planet), and wrath upon THIS people (which happens to be the very people He was among). And they (THIS PEOPLE mentioned in verse 23) shall fall by the edge of the SWORD (not AK 47s, not RPGs), and shall be led away CAPTIVE into ALL NATIONS (so Israelis will be slaves in New York, Tokyo, Beijing, Johannesburg, Moscow):and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Hebrews 9:1-14.

Hebrews 9:1 a worldly sanctuary.

Hebrews 9:24-26 Christ needs no temple, because His sacrifice of this Lamb takes away the sin of the world.

A THIRD temple is an impossibility because it would make the sacrifice of Jesus of non effect. But for Daniel and Matthew 24 to be future MUST nessesitate a rebuilt temple. We don’t study this worrying about alternatives, because of outcomes. We must study to find out the true intent of Christ and the apostles.
Hebrews is trying to show the readers that the age of the Temple sacrifices and mediator priesthood were coming to an end. The only holy people would be baptized in the holy name of God, Jesus Christ. The Holy Spirit of Christ would only dwell in ONE TEMPLE the Body of Christ. The old temple removed, the new Temple built, the Apostolic Church of Jesus Christ.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Esaias

If Jesus died in 33 AD, the time to the destruction of Jerusalem is 37.5 years (rounded to 38, it was in the 38th year that Jerusalem fell). The wilderness wanderings may have included parts of 2 years, for a TOTAL ACTUAL time of 38 years, but rounded to 40 (partial years reckoned as full years). HOWEVER, there is no way I can see how to take the 37.5 actual years to AD 70, rounded to 38 (partial year reckoned as full year), and THEN round AGAIN to get 40 years.

BUT THEN I SAW THIS:

From what I can tell, the FIRST siege of Jerusalem by Babylon lasted 30 months to the fall of the city. The Roman siege lasted about 5 months to the fall of the city. The DIFFERENCE between the two is 2.5 years, which added to the 37.5 years from the cross comes to 40 years.

Not sure if that means much, but I can't help but suspect it is significant.

Read this again, I need to clarify something.

The first siege was 30 months, or 2.5 years. The Roman siege was about half a year. The time from resurrection to destruction of Jerusalem was 37.5 years. Adding the time of the first siege of Jerusalem (2.5 years) gives a full 40 years.

So the siege of Jerusalem by the Babylonians may (speculating here) be a part of the forty years probationary period allotted to Jerusalem. Or, maybe under another perspective, the time of it's first siege was subtracted from the 40 years as "time already served". Either way, it implies the first siege is part of the post resurrection forty year probationary period.

How so?

In the parable Jesus gave explaining the 70x7 times pardon, the debt owed at the beginning was exacted at the end. So, in a sense, the debt exacted in Jerusalem's first siege was part of what would have been exacted in AD 70, but because it was already exacted it was subtracted from the AD 70 exaction of vengeance.

God is a master CPA, apparently.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Read this again, I need to clarify something.

The first siege was 30 months, or 2.5 years. The Roman siege was about half a year. The time from resurrection to destruction of Jerusalem was 37.5 years. Adding the time of the first siege of Jerusalem (2.5 years) gives a full 40 years.

So the siege of Jerusalem by the Babylonians may (speculating here) be a part of the forty years probationary period allotted to Jerusalem. Or, maybe under another perspective, the time of it's first siege was subtracted from the 40 years as "time already served". Either way, it implies the first siege is part of the post resurrection forty year probationary period.

How so?

In the parable Jesus gave explaining the 70x7 times pardon, the debt owed at the beginning was exacted at the end. So, in a sense, the debt exacted in Jerusalem's first siege was part of what would have been exacted in AD 70, but because it was already exacted it was subtracted from the AD 70 exaction of vengeance.

God is a master CPA, apparently.

Bro, do you have more of your own writings on this?
Is there an audio? (reasons why I ask for audios is because I play them at the job)

Nero declares war against Judea during the 12th year of his rule. What I personally believe is that Nero wanted to initially sack the Jerusalem temple. Since the great Roman fire had destroyed 3/4s of the city, he needed monies to rebuild. Temples around the occupation needed to be emptied to help build Rome. I believe Nero also ended the great Roman Temple (which was loaded) and took the tithes of tribute and spoils of Rome. 66-73 includes the mass suicide at Masada

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Bro, do you have more of your own writings on this?
Is there an audio? (reasons why I ask for audios is because I play them at the job)

Nero declares war against Judea during the 12th year of his rule. What I personally believe is that Nero wanted to initially sack the Jerusalem temple. Since the great Roman fire had destroyed 3/4s of the city, he needed monies to rebuild. Temples around the occupation needed to be emptied to help build Rome. I believe Nero also ended the great Roman Temple (which was loaded) and took the tithes of tribute and spoils of Rome. 66-73 includes the mass suicide at Masada

No writing or audio on this, I was just going off the top of my head here lately. I'm gonna have to maybe weave some of this into my book that I can't seem to get finished. Perhaps as an appendix on "The Seventy Weeks" or something.

I've tried to steer clear of timetables because that way is fraught with dangers galore.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Esaias

No writing or audio on this, I was just going off the top of my head here lately. I'm gonna have to maybe weave some of this into my book that I can't seem to get finished. Perhaps as an appendix on "The Seventy Weeks" or something.

I've tried to steer clear of timetables because that way is fraught with dangers galore.

Still awaiting my copy!

[Godsdrummer]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

What is the alternative? Christ already came? The resurrection already happened?

Yes The out come for you and I would still be the same.
when we die we would go to be with the Lord Just as Paul said we would.