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  #111  
Old 09-29-2007, 01:48 AM
Rico Rico is offline
Shaking the dust off my shoes.


 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa View Post
If Jesus preached it and David played his harp to it, I doubt you would give a care, listen if you can watch the spew on television and you can shout and run the pews of an Apostolic church after steady viewing of the blue screen, I highly doubt you would give ear to what I would say.




It's called a fellowship and there are guidelines to that fellowship. Meaning a statement of faith and to what the card holding members agree to believe on. Nothing Catholic about it, they are choosing to abstain from television, it's called taking a stand, but now that stand will be harder to hold.
Brother, if it's truly a conviction, then the passing of a resolution isn't going to change that conviction one bit. I remember when I left the uc church I used to go to. They gave me two years before I was putting up a Christmas tree and smooching with the wifey under the mistletoe. Guess what? It's been 7 years or so since I left and I still don't celebrate Christmas. God given convictions don't change.
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  #112  
Old 09-29-2007, 01:50 AM
Rico Rico is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redeemedcynic84 View Post
lol

I care a lot more about what Jesus preached than you show that you do in your posts...

Jesus didn't preach baptism... He barely preached the infilling of the Holy Ghost... But he did preach about love and compassion a lot... He preached about helping the poor and caring for the sick... He preached about doing good to people, even those who hate you and do bad things to you...

He preached about being a good person and doing good things... It wasn't this huge list of specific dos and don'ts, it was just a simple thing "do unto others as you would have them do unto you"... Real easy... real straightforward...



The points is (and what makes it "Catholic") is that there is no reason to take a stand... It was a man-made rule made in the 1970s and we are now, 40 years later, realizing that it was a mistake... There is nothing to take a stand on except the word of a bunch of MEN... Not God...

God said to use moderation and restraint, not ban things outright...

and he definately never said anything about restricting what you can use to reach people. Paul preached an entire sermon on a ROMAN GOD... I mean, come on. He actually went into the temple and told them that thier believe in this "unkown Roman God" was actually a belief in the God of Israel... He used the Roman Religion itself to make a case for Christ...

and you're tleling me we can't use some wires and tubes and signals??? Give me a break...
Jesus didn't preach baptism? How about Mark 16:16? Was He joking when He said it?
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  #113  
Old 09-29-2007, 01:52 AM
Rico Rico is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redeemedcynic84 View Post
But that's my point...

I've said it before, I'm all for personal convictions. God bless you for them, brother...

But your personal convictions end with you... You can't extend them to me.

I know the pandemic is happening all over the fellowship. Most of it is because the youth just know the rules and they don't have the heart for it, but you can't tell whether they have the heart for it or not because its so easy to follow the rules when mom and dad and Youth Pastor are looking that you can't tell whose really hurting most of the time (and when you can the wounds are so deep that we don't know how to fix them)...

I don't like the whole "pray a sinner's prayer" thing that mainline Christianity does... But I have to say thier focus on a relationship with Christ is so much better than our focus on dunking people and getting them to speak in tongues... Baptism and spirit infilling are important, yes, but we seem to stop there and forget everything else...

1 book in the New Testament deals with new believers being converted... 4 have to do with documenting Christ's death... and 21 have to do with living the life of a Christian...

But we spend 1/2 of our time on converting new believers... and the other 1/2 telling people what the list of dos and don'ts that we made says....

and they never really get a relationship with God to get to the point where they have personal convictions...

PLUS, even if they do get personal convictions, thier convictions are rejected as not good enough if they aren't convicted against all the same things that those in leadership are...

and I didn't take it as harsh at all. Frankly I thank God that you have convictions, because it is a sign that you have a real relationship with God... The only thing I think that people in our movement need to realize is that personal convictions are personal things and they cannot be applied across the board... We need to thank God for the personal convictions everyone has and do our best to respect the convictions of others (both the more strict ones and the less strict ones) and fellowship in harmony loving Christ... Because heaven isn't gonna be split with the standard folks and the not standard folks... we're all gonna be together, and we should start working on that togetherness here on this earth...
If all you are hearing at your church is just Acts 2:38 then I suggest you find another church. Even filet mignon gets old if you eat it every night.
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  #114  
Old 09-29-2007, 01:55 AM
Rico Rico is offline
Shaking the dust off my shoes.


 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redeemedcynic84 View Post
I have a ton of teaching in a lot of different things, you'd probably be surprised all the things I've studied...



Yes, Jesus, in comparison to other things, didn't preach that much about the infilling of the spirit and definately not about it as we preach it...

yes, Jesus preached power from God and that is the Holy Spirit, but he preached love and kindness and respect for others a lot more than he ever preached about the Spirit...



Hey, that's what the Bible says, you can mock it all you want, but that doesn't change that Jesus' actual sermons to people were about love and charity and giving...

What good does it do that you do all the gifts of the spirit that you have all the power in heaven, if you don't have love??? I believe Paul said something like that.... and we seem to have forgotten it along the way...



Yes, they were flaming liberals... should tell you something about what we should be... We should be at the forefront of loving people, of accepting people, of helping people regardless of thier race, sexual orientation, class status, or religion...

If a Muslim is starving on the streets of Iraq WE the People of God should be working to help him get food, even if he never accepts the gospel, we should still be working to get him food.

This isn't about just saving people and making it to an otherworldly heaven, this is also suppose to be about making this life HERE ON EARTH like heaven...



See, this is where the talking down starts... You know nothing about me, you don't know my name outside of "larry" because I"ve used that as my nick before... You don't know the situation I'm in, the life I'm living, or the place I'm at, but yet you judge me somehow based upon some outward number of things I'm doing...

Your righteousness is as filthy rags, evangelist, I believe that's in the Bible, too, you should open it up yourself once in a while...

As is "the last shall be first and the first shall be last"... So have fun exalting yourself and telling yourself you are better, because in the end, it won't be you who God exalts because of your attitude...

and, yes, those men are ministers, and that is great and I respect them. But that doesn't mean thier word is infallible or gospel. They can (and did) make mistakes (and I'm not even saying the tv rule was a mistake... I'm just saying because they are human, they did make mistakes, period, I believe that's in the Bible, too)



Yes, 13 years in the church in 3 different youth groups, all with the same problems, all with the same dying people who only know rules and youth camp highs and don't actually know Christ because no one ever gave them that chance...

Yes, God banned Adam and Eve from the garden, but you need to open your Bible up again, brother, God didn't ban them because of the tree of knowledge of good and evil... He banned them so they couldn't get to the tree of life...

and I know you are amazed that I think I can be on your level, I stated that in the last post. That you are arrogant and full of yourself and you think because you can "do things" that you are somehow better than me... All your post did was prove me right.

and you can not answer me, that doesn't change a word of what I said or how correct it was. I hope God blesses you brother, and changes your heart, because it really needs it, whether you are willing to admit it or not...



Who said anything about converting to another religion??? TV isn't religion, bro, its a tool. In fact, the electronics in a television set are almost identical to the electronics in your computer monitor... Isn't that pretty amazing???

Even more amazing is I can order all the cable packages I want and never get an ounce of porn unless I order premium channels in those packages or above those packages...

But I can get millions of hours worth of porn movies, billions and probably trillians of porn pictures, and trillions of words of pornographic stories off of the Internet FOR FREE, at the click of a mouse...

Now you tell me which is more evil, me ordering www.skyangel.com where there isn't even a non-Christian channel on the network, or me having a high-speed connection to the Internet where I can stream high-definition porn for free anytime I want it...



You really don't get it, do you? Yes, there is commercialism and trash and advertisint and other things that are wrong...

But just like a gun has tons of uses that are good (hunting, defending oneself, one's family, and one's country, having fun shooting clay pigeons or targets, etc.), so does TV have tons of uses that are good. What you need is moderation and self-control, not rules and bans... That's the Biblical way of doing things...
Dude, you are ATE UP. You are so full of bitterness it's made you blind.
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  #115  
Old 09-29-2007, 01:56 AM
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tv1a tv1a is offline
God's Son


 
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I'm not angry. It's not my double standards on display. Care to explain why you make an idol out of a 30 year tradition? Care to explain why you let decisions made 30 years ago which do not hold up under scrutiny get a free ride?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa View Post
And I see you still can't handle the truth. You shouldn't let all this make you so angry, just relax it's not personal.

Television was a bad move. In any event, just remember time proves all things.

In Jesus name

Brother Benincasa

www.OnTimeJournal.com
__________________
A religious spirit allows people to tolerate hatred and anger under the guise of passion and holiness. Bill Johnson

Legalism has no pity on people. Legalism makes my opinion your burden, makes opinion your boundary, makes my opinion your obligation-Lucado

Some get spiritual because they see the light. Others because they feel the heat.Ray Wylie Hubbard

Definition of legalism- Damned if you do. Damned if you don't. TV
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  #116  
Old 09-29-2007, 01:59 AM
Rico Rico is offline
Shaking the dust off my shoes.


 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redeemedcynic84 View Post
I don't constantly want to stress mistakes and human errors... The problem is that most people in our movement want to pretend they didn't happen and tell people to just go on pretending like it never happened and not discuss it...

I do respect those men, but that doesn't mean I agree with everything they decided... See, I've seen people backslide and hurt themselves BECAUSE of our strict rules. I've seen people mess up thier lives because of our rules... and I've seen people be hurt by our rules...

What you don't get is that no one is commercializing anything... They are simply trying to reach the lost. No one is trying to make a quick buck at the expense of anyone, they just don't see why we can use the Internet but not TV...

They saw the need to avoid the television for the same reason that they saw the need to avoid the radio in the 1910s, the organ in the early 1800s, or Handel in the 1500s... The new thing is ALWAYS preached agianst... ALWAYS!! That is human nature. Every generation since Christ has preached against whatever new-fangled gadgets those kids are into today... Its about time that we as a people get out of the 1950s and the social mores and codes of that day and age and realize this is 2007... There's new and better things for you to preach against 'cuz its new (like the Internet)

I mean, its funny, you have all this faith in ministers to decide that TV is evil and should be prohibited (even just as a tool to get our name out to people), but you don't have faith in the same ministers to use the tool as a way to evangelize, rather you assume they're just gonna try and take people's money... I think that's kind of absurd...

and, no, I don't know you, but I know your attitude, I've seen it hundreds of times before both in real life and online and its always the same... I can tell your attitude, I can read your arrogance, and I can tell by what you say what you think of me... It isn't hard to do, bro...

See, your passion is rules... Mine is just helping people find God... That's the difference between you and me... I couldn't care less if a lady wears a pair of pants or not as long as she hears "Well done, good and faithful one"... But you don't care anything but about her following the rules... You just don't want her to have a tv or wear makeup (even necessary makeup which is not what the Bible was talking about), or wear pants... Its all about a rulebook with you...

I just want people to know God, to have a relationship with Him... If He wants all that other stuff, He'll let them know Himself...
Your passion is arguing, R. That's all you ever do around here. You say you want to win people and that is your passion? Then post some Bible studies for discussion. Do something other than argue with the traditionalists. They aren't the enemy.
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  #117  
Old 09-29-2007, 02:05 AM
Rico Rico is offline
Shaking the dust off my shoes.


 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Nunya bidness
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa View Post
And I see you still can't handle the truth. You shouldn't let all this make you so angry, just relax it's not personal.

Television was a bad move. In any event, just remember time proves all things.

In Jesus name

Brother Benincasa

www.OnTimeJournal.com
Brother, the biggest mistake apostolics made was to not see the potential tv had for evangelizing the world. We've seen the results of apostolics not embracing tv and, I have to be honest with you, we have done a lousy job of getting the truth out to the world. There's no good reason why a bunch of charlatans have taken TBN worldwide while we've stayed in the shadows. It's a disgrace to everything God commanded when He said to take the gospel to all the world. I'm glad this resolution has finally passed. Maybe we will finally do something to counter TBN. They are 30 years ahead of us. Thirty years of taking lies all over the world, when it could have been us spreading the truth of God's word.
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  #118  
Old 09-29-2007, 02:05 AM
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Praxeas Praxeas is offline
Go Dodgers!


 
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and play Devils Advocate
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Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:


  1. There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
  2. The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
  3. Every sinner must repent of their sins.
  4. That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
  5. That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
  6. The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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  #119  
Old 09-29-2007, 02:07 AM
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Praxeas Praxeas is offline
Go Dodgers!


 
Join Date: Feb 2007
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I wonder if Jesus ever preached against sin too? Hmmmmmmm
__________________
Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:


  1. There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
  2. The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
  3. Every sinner must repent of their sins.
  4. That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
  5. That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
  6. The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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  #120  
Old 09-29-2007, 04:18 AM
redeemedcynic84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rico View Post
Jesus didn't preach baptism? How about Mark 16:16? Was He joking when He said it?
one verse (2 if we include him telling Nicodemus to be born of the water)...

but how much more often did he talk about loving people? How much more often did he talk about forgiveness?? How much more often did he talk about compassion???

I know Jesus did talk about baptism at times... But we focus so much more on baptism than he did and so much less on other things than he did, which was my point...
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