My Signature Diagram - Page 12

Carpenter · #**111** 07-30-2008, 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coffee99

This diagram is reflective of what I believe.

This is interesting, we judge stuff based on what and how and who we believe.

Our beliefs are irrelevant. Our faith is one thing, but our beliefs are based on UNDERSTANDING and processing information.

There are so many levels of understanding and knowledge and maturity, and wisdom, and intelligence, how on earth can we say this is correct, because this is what I believe?

I am not saying you did this coffee, but your comment did strike the flint a bit.

Jermyn Davidson · #**112** 07-31-2008, 12:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rgcraig

So true!

I feel that as long as I acknowledge that Jesus is Lord is what matters!

So you mean there's hope for the Trinitarian believer in Jesus Christ?

Jermyn Davidson · #**113** 07-31-2008, 01:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover

What say you?

Does this fit into your theological construct of God?

Okinawa, Japan Flashback

"It's all in Him.
I't's all in Him.
The fullness of the Godhead is all in Him.
It's all in Him.
It's all in Him.
The Mighty God is Jesus and it's all in Him."

This diagram does not reflect the scriptural truth in one of the first UPCI songs I ever learned.

Is. 9:6
"Unto us a child is born. Unto us a Son is given. And His name shall be called, Wonderful, Counsellor, the Mighty God, the Everlasting Father, the Prince of Peace.

Nope, the diagram does not match this scripture either.

Jermyn Davidson · #**114** 07-31-2008, 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by U376977

Secondly is what most are posting about. The "is not." "Is not" is what "distinct" means. And folks if you have "distinctions" then you have the Trinity. It is confusing because obvisously the Father is not the Son is not the Holy Ghost. Oneness allows for that--that is where we use our "role" and "manifestation" terminology. But at the same time we say that Jesus is the Father, Son and Holy Ghost all at the same time.

Growing up Apostolic and attending Apostolic churches just about my entire adult life, I can count on 1 hand the times I've heard Jesus ref'd to as the Son of God-- a very important Biblical truth that we miss, IMHO.

There are distinctions and the distinctions mess with my Oneness theology too. One that comes to mind immediately is that you "can" blaspheme Jesus but if you blaspheme the Holy Ghost, there isn't any forgiveness.

Jermyn Davidson · #**115** 07-31-2008, 01:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rgcraig

I guess it's according to what direction you read the diagram.

These three are ONE

OR

This one is three - - - LOL!

1 Sam. 16:14
But the Spirit of the Lord departed from Saul and an {evil} spirit from the Lord troubled him.

And in Revelations, "the seven spirits of God" are mentioned in several places.

Where do these scriptures fit into this diagram?
Where do these scriptures fit into Oneness Theology?

They don't.

Tim Rutledge · #**116** 07-31-2008, 03:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover

Of course no one is saying that there are two Spirits, but look at it this way... are there not things that can be said about the one that cannot be said about the other? (meaning Father and Holy Spirit)

Even by definition "Our Father which art in Heaven" is a parental term, while the Holy Spirit, "he maketh intercession for the saints according the to will of God." See Romans 8:27

The Holy Ghost overshadowed Mary and she concieved. Holy Ghost not Father. HG. must be a parental term.

Father,Son,Spirit our all just different modes of operation in the One Almighty God.

The (capitol L) Lord.. Is Jesus.

All the Godhead bodily dwelt in Jesus. Jesus was all of God (Father) manifested in the flesh.

Brother Price · #**117** 07-31-2008, 04:37 AM

To all, trinitarians and Oneness, who think they have God all figured out, and have been able to fit the theology of God into their own box, you are sadly mistaken.

God is one. This is a truth that has been evident throughout all of creation. But, all of His attributes and all His ways, we cannot nor shall we know. And no way is man smart enough or big enough to comprehend the vast nature of God.

OneAccord · #**118** 07-31-2008, 05:09 AM

Stephen Hoover-

Regarding the diagram... is this your work? I mean, did you draw the diagram? I don't have a problem with it.... in fact, while it does seem to over-simplify the concept of God, it does explain the Godhead... as someone said... depending on how you look at it.
My "understanding" of the Godhead came to me while drawing circles on a piece of paper years ago. That helped me to come to an understanding of the mystery of the Godhead.

In reading thru this thread (which, shockingly and surprizingly, hasn't turned into an all out, free for all, debate... thankfully) the words "God is..." stuck in my head. The Bible teaches us that the very first thing we must do is believe in God. We must believe "God is..." The Bible also teaches the Spirit of truth (Holy Ghost) will lead us into all truth. So, my job is to believe God is. Then, I allow the Holy Ghost to fill in the blank. "God is _________________".

Back to the diagram- IMO, it serves to teach the Oneness view very well. And, it would be interesting to see how trinitarians react to it. I think we'd be surprized to find many of them would agree with it. Which isn't a bad thing. That would show that this great big gulf that we have created between the trinitarian view of the Godhead and the Oneness view isn't so great afterall. I've said it here before- I have never talked to a person about God who believes in three or more Gods.

I believe in God.

I believe in Jesus, the Son of God.

I believe in the Holy Ghost

I believe these three are one. I don't know how the three are one other than to say a man can be a father, a son, and a husband all at the same time. I think though, we spend too much time trying to "fill in the blank". The Holy Spirit was given to do that for us- and He does all things well!

shag · #**119** 07-31-2008, 05:59 AM

I agree on the big gulf not being so big. Just last nite, my pastor mentioned trinitarians believe in 3 gods . IMO, it was just to make sure the new convert listeners stay away from trinitarianism(while attempting to justify oneness), because they know they're can't be 3 gods. I disapprove of that tactic, since I don't believe that most trinitarians see them as 3 separate gods.

rgcraig · #**120** 07-31-2008, 06:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OneAccord

Stephen Hoover-

Back to the diagram- IMO, it serves to teach the Oneness view very well. And, it would be interesting to see how trinitarians react to it. I think we'd be surprized to find many of them would agree with it. Which isn't a bad thing. That would show that this great big gulf that we have created between the trinitarian view of the Godhead and the Oneness view isn't so great afterall. I've said it here before- I have never talked to a person about God who believes in three or more Gods.

I believe in God.

I believe in Jesus, the Son of God.

I believe in the Holy Ghost

I believe these three are one. I don't know how the three are one other than to say a man can be a father, a son, and a husband all at the same time. I think though, we spend too much time trying to "fill in the blank". The Holy Spirit was given to do that for us- and He does all things well!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover

I believe both diagrams are accurate and biblical.

The first one is used by many Trinitarians to "explain" the Godhead.

One Accord,

The diagram is what Trinitarians use to explain the Godhead.