UPC Driving the Women Away?

[SiblingRevelry]

Originally Posted by RandyWayne

It is fascinating to me as well because I see it as an attempt by women to gain some sort of authority or power in the church and/or family. In conservative circles a woman may not be allowed to do much other than raise children and teach other younger women, but NOW she has special power and significance in the form of "holy magic hair". And since it helps to further the no-cut doctrine already held to, very few are willing to dispute it. After all, the ends justify the means.

Randy, I think you've hit the nail on the head.

When you don't have any authority in your personal life except in your home and over your children (and, if you work, maybe at your workplace), you would encourage a belief that emphasizes your home life and motherhood. Uncut hair would be something like that. It says to a woman that if she doesn't cut her hair, and is faithful in that, that God will be faithful to her and will help her when she has a problem in the areas under her authority. It has to be a very seductive doctrine. Even I, a single woman with no children (but with waist-length hair) can really resonate to the idea that "if I do this, God will honor me and heal my children." Particularly in those colorful descriptions of women taking down their hair and draping it over their children as they pray.

Also, it would give the woman a reason why she can't cut her hair to be like "the world." Not even to trim it. That would buoy up a woman's spirits, particularly on days when her hair is a tangled mess, has the death of static cling or gets caught in the car door.

Finally, it's not something a man can question her about. Because men are not supposed to have uncut (long) hair, only women. It's kind of like a female priesthood of long hair.

[Bro-Larry]

I don't wish to address the issue of more women than men in all churches, I do know of one church in East Texas in which the pastor is the only man.

I have however, observed an interesting phenomenon, which has occured when some conservative Apostolic churches have given up man-made doctrines:

Mega-Churches happened.

Covenant Church in Carrollton Texas, est circa 1978, Mike Hayes had about 60 to 80 members, until they left the UPC and dropped a lot of traditions of men. They never dropped repentance, Jesus' name baptism and Holy Ghost baptism.

Today 15,000 to 20,000 members, hundred or more pastors.

Just one of many many examples. This doesn't happen in every case for any number of reasons.

[RandyWayne]

Originally Posted by Bro-Larry

I don't wish to address the issue of more women than men in all churches, I do know of one church in East Texas in which the pastor is the only man.

I have however, observed an interesting phenomenon, which seems to occur when some conservative Apostolic churches give up man-made doctrines:

Mega-Churches happen.

Covenant Church in Carrollton Texas, est circa 1978, Mike Hayes had about 60 to 80 members, until they left the UPC and dropped a lot of traditions of men. They never dropped repentance, Jesus' name baptism and Holy Ghost baptism.

Today 15,000 to 20,000 members, hundred or more pastors.

Just one of many many examples. This doesn't happen in every case for any number of reasons.

I bet in these cases that prayer and fasting is one thing NOT given up though. In fact, it probably increases or at least the "quality" of it does since there is most likely more "humbleness" in the acts.

[ChTatum]

Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover

Fair enough. So then there would be an influx of women if further adjustments were made regarding standards??

I think at some point we need to seriously consider the lawfulness of multiple wives then, because the men are already outnumbered.

Ain't no way!!!!!

Uh, never mind, I'm not UPC........

[ChTatum]

Originally Posted by brotherjason

I came from a church where the ministry are looked up to almost like they are Jesus Himself. The ministry is supposed to lead by example as much as by their teachings but I think that this has been lost. Honor to whom honor is due doesn't mean we should worship them. I have put two pastors on a pedestal in my life, looked up to them like they were my biological fathers but I found out they are just men like me, no different.

Uh, and your biological father(s)s aren't?

LOL!

[Margies3]

Originally Posted by Bro-Larry

I don't wish to address the issue of more women than men in all churches, I do know of one church in East Texas in which the pastor is the only man.

I have however, observed an interesting phenomenon, which has occured when some conservative Apostolic churches have given up man-made doctrines:

Mega-Churches happened.

Covenant Church in Carrollton Texas, est circa 1978, Mike Hayes had about 60 to 80 members, until they left the UPC and dropped a lot of traditions of men. They never dropped repentance, Jesus' name baptism and Holy Ghost baptism.

Today 15,000 to 20,000 members, hundred or more pastors.

Just one of many many examples. This doesn't happen in every case for any number of reasons.

I am not a "standards person". In fact, I am probably more liberal than 99% of the people here.

but I don't believe for a minute that those churches took off and grew like they did because they gave up the standards. I think what probably happened more likely is that they grew because the people were so hungry to experience more of God that they were willing to do whatever it took. If it meant throwing out their old comfortable traditions, then so be it. And if it meant getting on their knees and seriously seeking God in prayer and fasting, then that's what they would do. If it meant getting off of their comfortable pews and reaching out to a lost and dying world, they were willing to do whatever it took to reach them. And so God honored their sincere desire to know Him better and more.

[franklyn4]

Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover

why are there such a disproportionate amount of women in the UPC pews?

99.9% of churches and denominations are disproportionately female.

[Hoovie]

Originally Posted by franklyn4

99.9% of churches and denominations are disproportionately female.

I was not aware of that statistic but assumed it was likely so. The point is... I am not so convinced that women are repelled by conservative dress standards.

[Esther]

Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover

I was not aware of that statistic but assumed it was likely so. The point is... I am not so convinced that women are repelled by conservative dress standards.

What do you base that thought on?

[ChTatum]

Different train of thought, but I believe there are certain personality types that are drawn to a strict mode of living,they NEED the standards, perhaps for validation or identity.