A Few of the Great Hell Sermons from History

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson

Maybe somebody can tell us what the wages of sin is death means ?
In kindness how does one who follows the ur doctrine,understand the wages of sin is death ?

The wages of sin is death. Death is the absence of life. When one physically dies they have suffered that price. However, there is a spiritual side to death. Separation from God (regardless as to how long) is a form of death. Those who perish in sin will be separated from God, suffering spiritual death. However, this may not be eternal in the sense of lasting forever. You see Jesus paid that price for each and every one of us... was his (the humanity's) separation from the Father everlasting? Christ only spent three days in the grave. If that paid the price in full... how can spiritual death be without end?

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Aquila

God's Word in the ancient Hebrew, Aramiac, and Greek... or God's Word in Latin?

Good points. I don't see any issue with God appearing brutal. Even to burn someone in Hell for a thousand years for sins committed over a span of only 50 years is brutal. For me the issue is... who wins. Satan's goal is to alientate creation from God. If Satan alienates 90% of creation from God... technically he succeeded in his goal. Christ died to save all of humanity. If only 10% of humanity is "saved", Jesus fell tragically short of his goal. And the winner is... Satan.

Colossians 1:20
And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

The Bible states that God will reconcile all things to himself. Will he? Yes or no?

I'm not totally convinced of UR teaching. However, I see how it provides the ultimate victory against sin and Satan. It also demonstrates a love for all humanity that trancends judgmentalism and strife.

the bold part I say "exactly" to. How come they don't see the other judgements of God, where people were killed, as brutal? Doesn't add up on their part.

What, there, does reconcile and all THINGS...note not all people, but all things....mean? What does that mean?

A lot of times when I see verses like that quoted, they are quoted apart from the context. Often the context shows the author speaking of those that believed, as opposed to those that don't.

the word Reconcile means "to bring back a former state of harmony"

notice the comparison in two verses.

Col 1:20 and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether on earth or in heaven, making peace by the blood of his cross.
Col 1:21 And you, who once were alienated and hostile in mind, doing evil deeds,
Col 1:22 he has now reconciled in his body of flesh by his death, in order to present you holy and blameless and above reproach before him,
Col 1:23 if indeed you continue in the faith, stable and steadfast, not shifting from the hope of the gospel that you heard, which has been proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, became a minister.
You got ALL THINGS and you have "AND YOU"...and in that case Paul gives a conditional "if indeed you continue in the faith, stable and steadfast...."

I think the ALL THINGS refers to everything else...the system of things, God's government, the creation. It will be put back in harmony.

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by Timmy

BTW, CJ, are you invisible for some reason? I can never seem to "catch" you online.

You can always PM me, if you like.

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

the bold part I say "exactly" to. How come they don't see the other judgements of God, where people were killed, as brutal? Doesn't add up on their part.

What, there, does reconcile and all THINGS...note not all people, but all things....mean? What does that mean?

A lot of times when I see verses like that quoted, they are quoted apart from the context. Often the context shows the author speaking of those that believed, as opposed to those that don't.

the word Reconcile means "to bring back a former state of harmony"

notice the comparison in two verses.

Col 1:20 and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether on earth or in heaven, making peace by the blood of his cross.
Col 1:21 And you, who once were alienated and hostile in mind, doing evil deeds,
Col 1:22 he has now reconciled in his body of flesh by his death, in order to present you holy and blameless and above reproach before him,
Col 1:23 if indeed you continue in the faith, stable and steadfast, not shifting from the hope of the gospel that you heard, which has been proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, became a minister.
You got ALL THINGS and you have "AND YOU"...and in that case Paul gives a conditional "if indeed you continue in the faith, stable and steadfast...."

I think the ALL THINGS refers to everything else...the system of things, God's government, the creation. It will be put back in harmony.

UR does not say that those that do not enter into the faith will be held blameless. However, this in no way negates the eventual reconciliation. Those that are steadfast and stable will be blameless and will enter immediately into the aionion life.

But to preach sermons and doctrine as exemplified in this original post is to vilify God, and is completely out of order, and contradictory to the nature of God. Please don't tell me that you would defend that type of fear mongering.

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

How will the URs feel....if they indeed make it to heaven, only to find out that all the nasty stuff they said about God....the God of the bible that DOES in fact allow the unbelievers to perish in hell? Will they demand God send them away rather than spend an Eternity with such a monster (their words)?

Again I have to remind us, what matters is what GOD'S word SAYS on the matter. Not emotive posturing. Not philosophical musings. When a person defines their God by such devices they are infact creating a false god made in their own image.

What? I would never have dream of Prax, using emotive posturing?? LOL