Any willing to answer my question?

[hometown guy]

Originally Posted by 1Corinth2v4

Hometownguy,


Thanks for understanding my argument. The emphasis isn't the "organization," but the pastor and elders within the organization, to which we are submitted.

Hometownguy, as you clearly stated, if you were advised against leaving the UPCI by your pastor or elders, you wouldn't have left, which is a display of obedience and submission.

Now, these men which left the UPCI were advised not to leave by their pastor and their elders. Yet these men defied their pastors, elders, and Hebrews 13:17. Now, these very same men preach that you can't leave their circle of fellowship, and you must cling to your elders and obey them. They preach you have to "stick it out through thick and thin!" They claim if you leave their circle of fellowship, you're lost, rebellious, and going to hell?

If they leave the UPCI, they're doing God's will. If we leave their groups, we're backsliding. Does that sound logical to you?

The bible reads leaders must lead by example! How can these hypocrite pastors condemn individuals to hell when these pastors are committing the same acts?


Hebrews 13:17
Obey your leaders and submit to their authority. They keep watch over you as men who must give an account........




Does that seem logical to you?

To my knowledge No pastor in our fellowship circle left the org without their elders permission........ Oh by the way most of them got kicked out because they didn’t pay their dues. J can you believe that?

[1Corinth2v4]

Originally Posted by hometown guy

To my knowledge No pastor in our fellowship circle left the org without their elders permission........ Oh by the way most of them got kicked out because they didn’t pay their dues. J can you believe that?

Well, I'm aware of who was advised against leaving, and it had a great emotional impact on their elders.

Also, these men weren't kicked out of the orginization. These men terminated thier membership from the orginization due to their non-compliance of payment, and we also know thier true motives for not paying their dues.

Some of these men let their dues expire without giving reason for their actions. When Satan terminated himself from heaven's scene, we discover what propmted his departure. Satan stated, "I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God.."

I guess Satan displayed a little more courage and gave a reason?

[hometown guy]

Originally Posted by 1Corinth2v4

Well, I'm aware of who was advised against leaving, and it had a great emotional impact on their elders.

Also, these men weren't kicked out of the orginization. These men terminated thier membership from the orginization due to their non-compliance of payment, and we also know thier true motives for not paying their dues.

Some of these men let their dues expire without giving reason for their actions. When Satan terminated himself from heaven's scene, we discover what propmted his departure. Satan stated, "I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God.."

I guess Satan displayed a little more courage and gave a reason?

no, they wanted to go out without making a big deal. and like i said THEIR elders did not advise them different abou leaving, maybe some of their friends in high place in the org did but not their elders or pastors.

[1Corinth2v4]

Originally Posted by hometown guy

no, they wanted to go out without making a big deal. and like i said THEIR elders did not advise them different abou leaving, maybe some of their friends in high place in the org did but not their elders or pastors.

I know some of their pastors/elders, and they were advised not to go.

By the way, if all these men didn't want to make a big deal, they would have just paid their dues and kept having separated fellowship meetings. Instead, they all decided to leave, which made the big deal.

[hometown guy]

Originally Posted by 1Corinth2v4

I know some of their pastors/elders, and they were advised not to go.

By the way, if all these men didn't want to make a big deal, they would have just paid their dues and kept having separated fellowship meetings. Instead, they all decided to leave, which made the big deal.

we must know different pastors that left. and why would you pay dues to something that you dont agree with?

[CC1]

Originally Posted by 1Corinth2v4

Well, I'm aware of who was advised against leaving, and it had a great emotional impact on their elders.

Also, these men weren't kicked out of the orginization. These men terminated thier membership from the orginization due to their non-compliance of payment, and we also know thier true motives for not paying their dues.

Some of these men let their dues expire without giving reason for their actions. When Satan terminated himself from heaven's scene, we discover what propmted his departure. Satan stated, "I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God.."

I guess Satan displayed a little more courage and gave a reason?

1Corinth2v4,

I have to admit I have been surprised with your posts on this thread. When the World Wide Wrestling Pentecostal Fellowship came about I figured you would have been leading the parade to join up.

I think the method of leaving the UPC by non payment of dues can be taken several different ways. For some it probably truly was their way of non confrontationally leaving. For others it was probably an intended insult to the UPC that they would leave with no explanation and in some cases no consultation with elders.

[1Corinth2v4]

Originally Posted by hometown guy

and why would you pay dues to something that you dont agree with?

Prior to these men leaving the UPCI, such as your pastor and others, these men were already having separate meetings (e.g camp, youth, fellowship meetings)

Why were these men paying their dues while already in disagreement with some UPCI "functions?"

You asked, "why would you pay dues to something that you don't agree with?"

I think your pastors, and other pastors you know could answer that question, understanding they were paying dues while holding their own meetings, because there were in disagreement with surrounding UPCI churches.

So I guess the answer to your question is yes, you can pay dues to something you don't agree with. Your pastor and others were doing it for along time before the TV resolution passed.

[1Corinth2v4]

Originally Posted by CC1

1Corinth2v4,

I have to admit I have been surprised with your posts on this thread. When the World Wide Wrestling Pentecostal Fellowship came about I figured you would have been leading the parade to join up.

I'll be leading the parade to heaven


(p.s. I'll take you in the ring any day bubba. However, after I beat you, you'll have to buy me an expensive dinner )

[hometown guy]

Originally Posted by 1Corinth2v4

Prior to these men leaving the UPCI, such as your pastor and others, these men were already having separate meetings (e.g camp, youth, fellowship meetings)

Why were these men paying their dues while already in disagreement with some UPCI "functions?"

You asked, "why would you pay dues to something that you don't agree with?"

I think your pastors, and other pastors you know could answer that question, understanding they were paying dues while holding their own meetings, because there were in disagreement with surrounding UPCI churches.

So I guess the answer to your question is yes, you can pay dues to something you don't agree with. Your pastor and others were doing it for along time before the TV resolution passed.

the tv resolution was the final straw. there was things that were going on that we didnt like but this resolution showed the direction of the org. and it was not the way we wanted to go.

[1Corinth2v4]

Originally Posted by hometown guy

the tv resolution was the final straw. there was things that were going on that we didnt like but this resolution showed the direction of the org. and it was not the way we wanted to go.

Hometownguy,

I must admit, I was upset when the resolution passed, as I personally knew it would create havoc amongst the organization. However, I haven't heard of any church advertising on television. In any-case, what impact should a preacher's decision have upon my life, due to his decision of advertising on television?


You stated, "and it was not the way we wanted to go." Forgive me, but I must point out your inconsistency. I was personally informed by pastors that both you and I know, they stated "we're not going to vote, it's getting tiresome. They'll only bring up the resolution next year if it's defeated this year." A massive portion of California didn't attend to vote down the resolution.

Yet, you stated "that's not the way we wanted to go?" What did "WE" meaning "YOU FOLKS" do to prevent the resolution from passing?


You also stated, "this resolution showed the direction of the org." The resolution in no manner displays the org's direction. There are brethren within high ranking positions that opposed the resolution, that's not including a mass multitude of ministering brethren through-out the USA. Within distance of you and I, there are many men whom are like-minded and didn't leave. I don't believe your statement about the org's direction holds any water.