Holiness Is Still Important

[Jeffrey]

Originally Posted by notofworks

You know, Jeffrey.....if someone thinks they should get rid of their TV, I would support them. But I would want them to understand it may not, and probably won't, change anything. But most importantly, they could not expect others to do the same. That's when it becomes legalism....when our personal preferences become another man's law. That's the definition of "Legalism."

That's not really support then.

Your statement about legalism, oif course I agree with you.

But I don't see how keeping one's home a sanctuary will not help them. Or, since AQP brought up the Matthew parable, if one's eye is offending them, how plucking it out won't be helpful! Of course it will.

It doesn't rid us of our problem. Which is why getting rid of a TV, or selective about movies, or filters on internet, is not about "do this and you're perfect and holy." It's accompanied by the Spirit, saying "Jesus you are LORD, and I'm setting up idols in my life that I'm worshippping (lust), and I worship you. If I truly believe you are LORD, I won't worship them. Help my unbelief." Then afterward, doing everything to make provision to avoid that trap.

If it's a certain girl at work one flirts with overboard. They choose a different route. If it's a certain drive home where it goes right by the beach front with scantily clad women that creates an inferno of raging thoughts, then they choose a different route. If it means conversations have gone too far with a part of the opposite sex, they never allow alone conversations with that person. It's us being led by the Spirit, taking responsibility for our own actions. Grace has our back, but it's not going to let us lay down and bring our idols in.

[allstate1]

@the legalist How holy do you have to be to be saved? How much praying fasting etc is acceptable? Where is you line in the sand?

[n david]

I worked in youth ministry with a young man who was dead-set against taking a summer trip to an amusement park (six flags) ... because there would be girls dressed immodestly at the park.

I took him outside to stand on the sidewalk beside the church and pointed across the street at a park where about 3 or 4 women were laying out in the sun, tanning, in bikinis. Told him the youth will see immodest dress anywhere, including in front of their church.

He was still against it. We ended up not going, but because of financial reasons, not immodest dress.

[proudfather]

Wow, this is pretty funny. I knew that I would stir up a hornets’ nest, but I never expected it all to happen so fast!

Let me do my best to explain the difference between Television and Internet. I am ignorant and unlearned, as most of you continue to point out, but I have been with Jesus.

I can put filters on my internet that keep me from viewing certain websites. I don't have to view a video on YouTube or watch a dirty commercial on the internet if I don't want to. My internet usage consists of Bible reading, looking up Sermon Illustrations, reading book reviews (Christian novels), e-mails, and this website. I do view statistics every now and then as well.

TV can also be used for good. After all, you can watch Benny Hehn and learn how to perform miracles. :O You can even watch the Newsboys sing praise and worship choruses. Oh yeah, and you can watch UPCI advertisements. While there are some good things on TV, there is also a lot of garbage displayed through commercials. They have a TV in our break room at my job and they only play the "clean" shows. Funny thing is, I can't even grab a coke without HEARING something about sex. In waiting rooms, they usually have the TV set on news channels, but I've heard horrible comments coming out of the tube. This is just the news channels.

Well, when something bad comes on, you just change the channel, right? I wonder if some of you out there have you kids with you when you start channel surfing. Also, how do you know that your kids aren't watching garbage when your back is turned? Well, they can do that with the internet too, right? Not if you lock your computer when you step away from it.

Some of you are probably thinking, "he's just saying that because that's what his parents teach." I'm sorry to inform you of this, but my parents own a Television. Go ahead and mock me. Call me names. Insult my intelligence. I received my convictions from God and no man or woman is going to take that away from me.

[allstate1]

If one is Holy in their mind and in their spirt I dont believe a tv program ,a bikini at the beach or anything else will overcome that! I dont consider myself a holy person but I watch movies from comedies to violence I have never had a desire to be a commedian or a violent criminal, I hear more curse words and swear words in a day than you can imagine but I dont use them, all of my co-workers drink at all company functions I am not even tempted, I see plenty of skin at the lake but I have no pervertd ideas! I believe Holiness is a state of mind and spirit and has very little do to with modestyor any clothing issue!

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by proudfather

From what I've read on this website thus far, I cannot imagine that this will be a popular thread. Never the less, I will post it anyway, because I am concerned about the Apostolic movement.

This movement has let go of a lot of things that it used to stand for. While most preachers still believe Acts 2:38, the message of Holiness has become a touchy subject. I was surprised when ministers sat on Bro. Guy Godwin when he taught against ladies cutting their hair. I thought that was a given! After all, 1 Corinthians 11:14-16 is still in the Bible. I love the way the NLT translates this passage: "14 Isn’t it obvious that it’s disgraceful for a man to have long hair? 15 And isn’t long hair a woman’s pride and joy? For it has been given to her as a covering. 16 But if anyone wants to argue about this, I simply say that we have no other custom than this, and neither do God’s other churches."

I'm not sure why we're suddenly confused about this subject. Men that preached this for years are now backing down from their previous stance. Television was preached against in the 60s. How much more so should we preach against it today? Every time this issue is brought up on this site, the same argument is presented; "What is the difference between Television and Internet?" I agree that anyone can use the Internet for evil if they want to. The same goes for the Bible. Let me explain. I can take the book of Song of Solomon and allow my imagination to run wild on certain verses. I can even take certain passages in the Gospel's and twist them to fit what I believe. If a person is determined to sin, then he will find a way. The Bible defines sin this way in James 4:17, "17Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin."

So should we preach against all technology? Of course not! What we need to consider here, is are we allowing ourselves to be tempted beyond what we can bear? If a person has a problem with porn, they shouldn't use the internet without the proper filters. In fact, no one should use the internet without the proper filters. If you have a problem with lust, don't watch video's that will awaken those desires. Here's what I believe. Don't watch Hollywood...period. Whether it's on a Television screen, DVD player, the internet, exc. don’t watch it! Television however, cannot be controlled. I can hear your responses now. "I control mine." "I've never watched bad programs on my TV set." Let me ask you a question, and you'd better answer it honestly. Has your definition of "bad" changed at all since you purchased that TV?

Me and my wife attended a church that let down the standard for a while. We went out and bought some movies during this ordeal, and we started out innocently enough by watching Disney movies, PG films, exc. However, we started watching Star Trek, Star Wars, Batman movies and other PG-13 films. Before we knew it, we were watching R rated films because they only contained one bad scene or just a few cuss words. The Holy Ghost convicted me in prayer and even though the church I was attending didn't preach against it, I got rid of every DVD that I owned.

Sound extreme? Let me tell you that Heaven is cheap at any price. I am willing to give up anything and everything if Christ convicts me to do so. Television may seem ok on the surface, but in reality, it is moving your boundaries. If it was wrong 30 years ago, it is still wrong today. Paul said, “For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor." I wouldn't want to stand in the shoes of a compromiser on the Day of Judgment. Scripture tells us that teachers/ministers are subject to a stricter judgment. I don't know about you, but I want to be saved.

Now, I will quote the words of Job: "Suffer me that I may speak; and after that I have spoken, mock on."

You're probably thinking that I am about 50 years old, ignorant, and countrified. Well, you're wrong on two accounts. I am in my 20's and I grew up in the city. I am ignorant, but God will use the unlearned to preach this Gospel. I am trying to learn more about him every day. I pray that I might know Him, in the power of the real Holy Ghost.

I may not agree with everything you believe regarding hair and dress codes... but I largely agree with what you wrote about technology. When it comes to hair, I believe a woman's hair should be long, I don't see a requirement for it being uncut. And though I don't see requiring dresses or skirts on women, I do believe that what is worn should be modest.

Great post!

[Sister Alvear]

wouldn't know....haven't heard any .....ha...

[TheLegalist]

Originally Posted by Jeffrey

And that worldy attitude is not exclusive to television either.

It creates an opportunity for the believer to contrast their faith and worldview.

I would agree be seasoning is important and the children should be prepared in Word to be able to see what is right and wrong. They can understand the aspects of life without trash being thrown at their feet to wade through.

[TheLegalist]

Originally Posted by allstate1

@the legalist How holy do you have to be to be saved? How much praying fasting etc is acceptable? Where is you line in the sand?

the line in the sand is the Spirit leading you and you not being enmity with his will. Thus by being a servant to the commands of God you are judged faithful.

Luk 13:23 Someone asked him, "Lord, will only a few be saved?" So he said to them,
Luk 13:24 "Exert every effortto enter through the narrow door, because many, I tell you, will try to enter and will not be able to.

[TheLegalist]

being Holy is about the WHOLE of a person.

If submission unto authority etc... is seen by women's long hair. Yet the women cuts it short. Then her hair is a weapon or tool of defiance.

If God wants women and men to dress distinctly from each other and women just simply don't worry about it and dress however close to the other sex they feel at the moment. That to me is a heart thats at enmity and the clothing is the manifestation of such carelessness. We will be judged by our works and that works is seen as unholy from heart to action.

Just some common examples due to what is constantly argued on this board.