Are Infants Really Born Sinless?

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Originally Posted by acerrak

I just wonder if that force wasnt in there until Paul sinned. I dont think adam had a compelling force like what paul was talking about.

This is a very interesting issue. I think the compelling force was in action before Paul sinned. Notice this:

Rom 7:7-11 KJV What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

Paul said he did not know anything about sin until he was introduced to the commandment.

(8) But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead. (9) For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.

He said before he sinned the commandment stirred sin up. SIN REVIVED. Without the law sin was dead. It was there in him, but described as being DEAD. Law REVIVED that DEAD SIN.

Now, we know it was a FORCE because Paul said it WARRED against his desire to do good. And he distinguished it from himself by saying, "it is no longer I that do it but sin that dwelleth in me." So this FORCE was DEAD in him until the commandment came. THEN IT REVIVED. This was before he actually sinned. He was simply being presented with law TO LEARN what sin was.

(10) And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death. (11) For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.

The way sin operated once it revived when Paul was given law was that it USED THAT LAW as a WEAPON and slew Paul.

Some believe Paul spoke of being presented with law, having not know sin, when he came of age as a Jew and was responsible for Law. Bar Mitzvah. Jewish children are not obligated to keep the law. But they become sons of the law at 12, 13 and celebrate that with Bar Mitzvah. Whatever the case, once Paul received law, that dead force of sin SIN suddenly revived and attacked.

So the force was activated before he actually sinned. The sin force in him stirred up as soon as he learned THOU SHALT NOT COVET. The force caused him to sin.

This is why I believe we are born with a sin nature that Adam was not born with.

He just saw eve take a bite and was alive. the snake used deception, and the word deceived is used by eve when God charges her.

I agree with this. So it shows Adam had no sin nature, whereas Paul did. Nothing in Adam "revived" to slay Paul. Adam knew exactly what he was doing and was not compelled whatsoever.