End Time Army of Women Preachers Psalms 68:11

[rdp]

Originally Posted by rdp

Ok, so I clicked on the link you provided, and this is what it says:
anér: a man
Original Word: ἀνήρ, ἀνδρός, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: anér
Phonetic Spelling: (an'-ayr)
Short Definition: a male human being, a man
Definition: a male human being; a man, husband.


Apparently you overlooked the fact that "husband" is merely a secondary meaning & ONLY if there are possessive markings in the text - which there are not in I Timothy 2.11-15 (which is also the reason hardly ANY linguists have adopted y'all quirky-esoteric "translation" ).


But, hey, I'm a fair man - I'll quote from renown linguist Dr. Joseph Thayer what you omitted from the same link :


ἀνήρ, ἀνδρός, ὁ, a man, Latinvir. The meanings of this word in the N. T. differ in no respect from classic usage; for it is employed

1. with a reference to sex, and so to distinguish a man from a woman; either a. as a male: Acts 8:12; Acts 17:12; 1 Timothy 2:12; or b. as a husband: Matthew 1:16; Mark 10:2; John 4:16ff; Romans 7:2ff; 1 Corinthians 7:2ff; Galatians 4:27; 1 Timothy 3:2, 12; Titus 1:6, etc.; a betrothed or future husband: Matthew 1:19; Revelation 21:2, etc.


Did ya' catch that? I Timothy 2.12 is translated under the category of "so to distinguish a man from a woman...a. as a male" - Not under heading "B" (i.e., the secondary meaning) of a "husband." Might need to learn hoe to read a lexicon before you chide me for my resources .


Right there in bold is the word husband. Now I know that you say that in the context that Paul couldn't possibly be talking about a husband. Well, that's your opinion. Let's look at that scripture in context again.


No, it is grammatical fact (as I'll once again demonstrate below) & not my "opinion" - you simply have an anti-biblical tradition you're desperately trying to protect & thus you've stubbornly dug in your heels. See it all the time .

8 I will therefore that men pray every where, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and doubting.
9 In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array;
10 But (which becometh women professing godliness) with good works.
11 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.
12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.
13 For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
15 Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.

Now unless I overlooked something, I did not see either the word "husband" or "wife" in this nor the following translations. Hmmm, what do you see (with no formal training Koine' Greek) that alllllll of these professional linguists missed ?


New International Version
But women will be saved through childbearing--if they continue in faith, love and holiness with propriety.

New Living Translation
But women will be saved through childbearing, assuming they continue to live in faith, love, holiness, and modesty.

English Standard Version
Yet she will be saved through childbearing—if they continue in faith and love and holiness, with self-control.

New American Standard Bible
But women will be preserved through the bearing of children if they continue in faith and love and sanctity with self-restraint.

King James Bible
Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
But she will be saved through childbearing, if she continues in faith, love, and holiness, with good judgment.

International Standard Version
even though she will be saved through the birth of the Child, if they continue in faith, love, and holiness, along with good judgment.

NET Bible
But she will be delivered through childbearing, if she continues in faith and love and holiness with self-control.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
But she lives by her children, if they continue in faith and in love, in holiness and in modesty.

GOD'S WORD® Translation
However, she [and all women] will be saved through the birth of the child, if they lead respectable lives in faith, love, and holiness.

Jubilee Bible 2000
notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if she continues in faith and charity and sanctification and modesty.

King James 2000 Bible
Yet she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and love and holiness with propriety.

American King James Version
Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.

American Standard Version
but she shall be saved through her child-bearing, if they continue in faith and love and sanctification with sobriety.

Douay-Rheims Bible
Yet she shall be saved through childbearing; if she continue in faith, and love, and sanctification, with sobriety.

Darby Bible Translation
But she shall be preserved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and love and holiness with discretion.

English Revised Version
but she shall be saved through the childbearing, if they continue in faith and love and sanctification with sobriety.

Webster's Bible Translation
Notwithstanding, she will be saved in child-bearing, if they continue in faith, and charity, and holiness, with sobriety.

Weymouth New Testament
Yet a woman will be brought safely through childbirth if she and her husband continue to live in faith and love and growing holiness, with habitual self-restraint.



The "context" is discussing man & woman (just as it's translated by literally hundreds of professional lingusist) - NOT "husband" & "wife." Why? Hmm, let's see, what did the foremost Greek scholar on the planet tell me again?


Gune and aner are words which mean 'adult female' and 'adult male' in their unmarked meanings. Only if there are sufficient contextual clues that husband and wife are in view do the words mean 'wife' and 'husband.' The definite article or 'idios' (one's own) or a possessive pronoun is required to show that husband and wife are in the text. None of these things occur in 1 Tim 2. The article occurs in 1 Cor 11, but only because it is syntactically required by the construction. Both passages are clearly talking about the Christian community in worship, which would of course involve single adults and married couples. Take a look at other passages that are clearly speaking about husband and wife--e.g., Eph 5, 1 Peter 3--and you'll see that they use these signals to note that husband and wife are in view.



Ignore it all y'all want - it isn't going to disappear .



This is my opinion too, because... no one of us can know exactly the mind of Paul as he was writing, but in looking at this verse from the context of the passage it was found in, Paul is addressing the husband/wife issue here, and which is why the word HUSBAND could certainly be used here (using your source as the reference for husband), as he mentions that the woman (wife) would be saved in childbearing. A single woman, or widow is not childbearing, a wife would be the only one childbearing. So, the context IS husband/wife.


No, the "context" can never violate the actual "text" - which says absolutely nothing about a "husband" or "wife," that is supplied by the pro-"woman-preacher" camp - no the biblical text itself.


The Scripture is simply saying that even though woman was the one to be "deceived" & "fall into transgression" - "nevertheless" (important term), normatively speaking, God has made a way-out for her via childbearing. This is what the actual text says, teaches, & is the very careful exegetical conclusion.


But, let's take your quirky interpretation for a moment. If this is talking about a "wife" not instructing her "husband" - then does God only "call" single women to "preach" ? Or, if somehow discussing the home-order, does that "order" suddenly do a 180 degree flip when they go to church ? Hmmm, strange that Paul appealed to the order of the home as the reflection of the order of the church, "(For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)."


Sorry - Think I'll stick with the Bible & let y'all have your own private interpretation in order to mold your lifestyle preferences into God's Word .



Now, I realize that with all your study of Greek, that it is possible that "much learning hath made you mad" (really, I believe you are sincere, and don't hold that against you). However, you have your opinion about the verse, which is fine. We have ours. Opinions may never meet. But, you continue to choose to acknowledge the fact that Paul taught a woman can prophesy in the church, but get hung up on the "remain silent in church", but you have NEVER SAID how that can be possible.


LOL - I have addressed that issue ad nauseum on here. Good debate tactic though. Perhaps some will be naive enough to not see what you're doing, but you're merely feigning the high ground of "victory" in order to save face in light of a losing argument. This, you do by claiming I've not answered you when I've answered you over-over-over-over-over-over & OVER !


I have stated that it is possible when a wife is in submission to her husband, that being under his authority, if she has been given a word from the Lord, she can speak.



You are looking at the forest without seeing the trees. Jesus talked ALONE to the Samaritan woman. Why would he do that? How awful, for a MAN to be ALONE with a woman. And then, after He talked to her ALONE, what did she do?


What she did NOT do is "preach a sermon from the Scriptures" ! Here, since y'all are apparently overlooking the straight question & absolutely refusing to provide ANY response whatsoever, I'll ask it again: Please provide for me one biblical text, in either the OT or NT where a woman ever once preached to any congregation out of the Scriptures:______________?



Cont.....

Bump of my rebuttal to KeptByTheWord (her assertions appear in plain black & my responses appear in either bold red or blue) - For those that missed it .