Universal Health Care

[OP_Carl]

Originally Posted by ChristopherHall

Dave, that doesn't make much sense. Because right now in America there are tens of thousands of elderly people barely able to buy food because they cannot afford the prescription drugs they need. Every year an estimated 18,000 Americans die because they are not granted coverage or cannot afford insurance that will help them get the care or treatments they need to survive. Bro, numbers of cases have been brought up before the Senate and have engaged the insurance companies in lawsuits because their loved one died. There are another 25,000 Americans who declare bankruptcy every year due to the inability to pay their medical bills.

Funny...none of this seems to bother you one bit. I'll tell you what it's really about...it's about the almighty dollar.

This confirms that you are neither reading nor comprehending. You are merely regurgitating the same stuff over and over again. Including your "laugh line."

The Law of God commanded land owners to leave the corners and edges of their fields for the destitute. It was a civil law of Moses. If this is theft, Jesus is a sinner...because Jesus and the disciples freely gleaned corn, with unwashed hands, in a field belonging to another. If Jesus is a sinner, your faith is in vain.

Utter nonsense This is totally unrelated.

Also let's read what Paul said in Romans 13,

" 1Everyone must submit himself to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2Consequently, he who rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. 3For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and he will commend you. 4For he is God's servant to do you good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword for nothing. He is God's servant, an agent of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. 5Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also because of conscience. 6This is also why you pay taxes, for the authorities are God's servants, who give their full time to governing. 7Give everyone what you owe him: If you owe taxes, pay taxes; if revenue, then revenue; if respect, then respect; if honor, then honor." - Romans 13:1-7 (NIV)

In this passage we have a number of truths. First, Government, like the family, is an ordained institution of God. And, Governments are established and set up by God. If one rebels against the rule of law they are in rebellion against the governing institution appointed by God bringing judgment upon themselves.

This is farcical. Nobody is suggesting civil nor violent disobedience. We have a new paradigm, unimaginable in bible times, where the individual is sovereign and participates in the making of the rules. In America, if we believe that a law is in error, we are FREE to work to revoke it. See prohibition. See slavery.

Nobody contending against your destructive socialist views currently defies the government via non-payment of taxes because they are against supporting social security, welfare, the war on drugs, or government schools.

You are, in essence, telling us to shut up and obey the law BEFORE NATIONAL HEALTH CARE IS THE LAW. This is either disingenuous or discombobulated.

This kind of thinking is dangerous to freedom of expression, action, and even freedom of thought. I showed you how you have put the cart before the horse, and are extolling the virtues of YET ANOTHER system that causes mankind to work against his own best interests. Even without religious connotations this is untenable in the long term. It has been proven untenable. And yet folks still promote more of it.

Thank God we are free to debate these things both before and after they are implemented. We've poured billions into the machine of government schools, and our students perform more poorly than ever. We've poured billions into the war on drugs, yet our nation's drug problems persist. We've received the warnings about the coming insolvency of social security for 20 years. There is plenty of evidence that federal social programs are ineffective at best and often make the problem worse, all the while wasting BILLIONS of dollars ($1,000,000,000.00) Yet some folks point to them anyhow as the reason to start yet another one?

One need no fear of rulers if they obey the laws.

The combination of state, local, and federal statutes are so convoluted NOW, largely due to muddled collectivist thinking, that it is impossible to obey all the laws. Societal order is kept via selective enforcement - yet another broad avenue for corruption.

The governing authorities will commend those who do what's right and obey the laws. Governing authorities are servants called to do good for the people. But law breakers have reason to fear because governing authorities have the authority to use force, the sword, to punish them. Governments serve God by punishing law breakers. Therefore it is necessary to obey the government, not only because you may be punished but because in doing so you will have a clear conscience. HEY, this is why you are to pay taxes. Because the governing authorities are the servants of God and give their lives to public service. You are to give what you owe. If you owe taxes, pay taxes. If revenue, pay revenue. If respect, then respect. If honor, then honor.

Do you believe that this paragraph should persuade ANYBODY, law-abiding or not, to become excited about and supportive of yet another tax?
Do you believe government creates wealth?
Where does the government get all this money for these programs? Do they just print it?
What increases the federal budget?
What increases the GDP?
What makes the economy grow?
Is income earned or distributed?
When the majority of a man's efforts to increase himself are confiscated by government, what incentive does he have to produce by his efforts more wealth for the taking?