Tongues and Interpretation?

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by crakjak

"If all you know is a scientific understanding of the scripture, you will never "know" God."

I already know God. The bible is a book, not a test tube. You read it and understand it. God gave you a brain, use it

Knowing God most definitely includes the emotions and spirit of humans.

Having a relationship but understanding God's word is not defined by one's whimful emotions. How do you think we got so many false doctrines going around? Everyone thinks they "feel" what is right.

That is the exact point I was making. "...the letter kills, it is the spirit that makes alive..." It is not either or it is both!!!

If you think for one second that means the word of God (letter) kills you are seriously deluded or you are simply mis-using the word of God for your own argument. I suppose you think it's ok to go out and hang yourself because Jesus said "go thou and do likewise"? The word of God must be handled honestly and intelligently or you will never "know" God..see how it works?

I did not judge you, maybe you judged yourself? Based on the bolded, in your quotes above, who is judging who?

You, you speculated that I did not know God. Before that you speculated/insinuated that churches that have the gifts in operation are shallow churches

Of course it is my opinion, based on my knowledge and experience.

You're experience is subjective. You presume a church that is more deeper teaching is somehow more spiritual, yet you just spent time actually trying to refute such a notion lol...I bet you won't even get that point

You quote a lot of scripture, you readily apply YOUR opinions and YOUR understanding of what certain scriptures mean. This is a discussion, I will post scripture and my opinions as I choose, you can choose to engage my posts or not.

I don't claim my views of doctrine is based on emotions. I don't claim the bible means whatever I "feel" it should mean. This IS a discussion and I HAVE been engaging what you've said, that's why we are here

You would do well to engage the discussion, voicing your opinions and quoting scripture, but tone way down on the attack mode. We are friends here and should carry on as such. You have good opinions and understanding to share, but quite frankly you cause your audience to be very hesitate to receive some of your contributions.

Well wait a second, you imply I don't know God and you are gonna point your finger at me? ROFL. I was just testing your words vs scriptures, you were the one that suggested I don't know God CJ

This is my opinion and my observations, you may do with it what you will.

I have been and will

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

I already know God. The bible is a book, not a test tube. You read it and understand it. God gave you a brain, use it


Having a relationship but understanding God's word is not defined by one's whimful emotions. How do you think we got so many false doctrines going around? Everyone thinks they "feel" what is right.


If you think for one second that means the word of God (letter) kills you are seriously deluded or you are simply mis-using the word of God for your own argument. I suppose you think it's ok to go out and hang yourself because Jesus said "go thou and do likewise"? The word of God must be handled honestly and intelligently or you will never "know" God..see how it works?


You, you speculated that I did not know God. Before that you speculated/insinuated that churches that have the gifts in operation are shallow churches


You're experience is subjective. You presume a church that is more deeper teaching is somehow more spiritual, yet you just spent time actually trying to refute such a notion lol...I bet you won't even get that point


I don't claim my views of doctrine is based on emotions. I don't claim the bible means whatever I "feel" it should mean. This IS a discussion and I HAVE been engaging what you've said, that's why we are here


Well wait a second, you imply I don't know God and you are gonna point your finger at me? ROFL. I was just testing your words vs scriptures, you were the one that suggested I don't know God CJ


I have been and will

You mistook my words: I did not suggest that you don't know God, nor do I think that you don't. Nor did I say that churches that have the gifts in operation are shallow, nor do I think that.

I said that to know God you must have both a emotional and an intellectual knowledge of Him. Jesus is the Word, therefore a good working knowledge of scripture is required, but a solid emotional response to scripture is also required to know God. The Word will "kill" the unbalanced scholar, just as we have recently seen in the "Rev" Camping, and we can see the emotionally imbalanced on TBN and the like quite regularly.

As to the gifts, I was decrying the MISUSE of the gifts of T&I, I'm not sure you really disagree with these points?

You may have attacked my presentation because you love argumentation, I think???

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by crakjak

You mistook my words: I did not suggest that you don't know God, nor do I think that you don't. Nor did I say that churches that have the gifts in operation are shallow, nor do I think that.

Don't blame me. I did not mistook anything, you mis-spoke. That is exactly what your posts implied. Maybe you did not think that was your intention but that is exactly what your posts imply

I said that to know God you must have both a emotional and an intellectual knowledge of Him.

that is NOT what you said. You said to ME that I will never know God. And besides I never once suggested we don't need an emotional anything with God. You always do that when this topic comes up,twist my words.

Jesus is the Word, therefore a good working knowledge of scripture is required, but a solid emotional response to scripture is also required to know God. The Word will "kill" the unbalanced scholar, just as we have recently seen in the "Rev" Camping, and we can see the emotionally imbalanced on TBN and the like quite regularly.

that has absolutely NOTHING to do with what I've been saying and what we've been discussing

As to the gifts, I was decrying the MISUSE of the gifts of T&I, I'm not sure you really disagree with these points?

No you were not!

Here is what you said, nothing about misuse

Much of the desire for T&I comes when the ministry is majoring in the minors, and not presenting deep spiritual and practical truths. The folks get restless and hungry for what God desires.

So churches that desire T&I do so because the ministry is shallow.

While Im on it, let me quote your other tidbits

"I believe this deep longing came because of a lack of deep expository preaching that satisfies the spiritually hunger of believer"

And then here is what you said to me, first of all implying that all I know is a scientific understanding of scriptures (not true) and that I don't know God

I can speak the truth form experience and understanding, without quoting scripture. If all you know is a scientific understanding of the scripture, you will never "know" God.

And while I take exception to your accusation that all I know is a scientific understanding of scriptures and that I don't know God, I have to disagree that you can speak the truth from experience and understanding without quoting scriptures. The bible is our foundation. Protestants left the Roman system years ago because the thought they could speak the truth apart from scriptures or have some knowledge externally from scriptures. If you are going to judge or declare a truth, it better be backed up by God, the God of the bible

You may have attacked my presentation because you love argumentation, I think???

Another personal accusation? CJ did I misread this too?

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Don't blame me. I did not mistook anything, you mis-spoke. That is exactly what your posts implied. Maybe you did not think that was your intention but that is exactly what your posts imply


that is NOT what you said. You said to ME that I will never know God. And besides I never once suggested we don't need an emotional anything with God. You always do that when this topic comes up,twist my words.


that has absolutely NOTHING to do with what I've been saying and what we've been discussing


No you were not!

Here is what you said, nothing about misuse


So churches that desire T&I do so because the ministry is shallow.

While Im on it, let me quote your other tidbits



And then here is what you said to me, first of all implying that all I know is a scientific understanding of scriptures (not true) and that I don't know God



And while I take exception to your accusation that all I know is a scientific understanding of scriptures and that I don't know God, I have to disagree that you can speak the truth from experience and understanding without quoting scriptures. The bible is our foundation. Protestants left the Roman system years ago because the thought they could speak the truth apart from scriptures or have some knowledge externally from scriptures. If you are going to judge or declare a truth, it better be backed up by God, the God of the bible


Another personal accusation? CJ did I misread this too?

My posts speak for themselves, I will not tit for tat with you. You can twist others words ever so expertly, but you miss the point by miles, discussion with you is impossible.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by crakjak

My posts speak for themselves.

Yes and I've been quoting them and responding. Now, rather than blame me for misunderstanding perhaps you see now that I quoted you verbatim you can humble yourself for a change and see that you were wrong

[acerrak]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

verbatim you can humble yourself for a change and see that you were wrong

maybe one day we can get that from you as well

[Praxeas]

Ive admitted many times that what I posted was worded wrong rather than blame the other guys. This isn't me telling him to admit his doctrine is false if that is what you thought

The guy actually said what he said, I quoted him. You can read it yourself Acerrak rather than being a smart mouth.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by acerrak

maybe one day we can get that from you as well

Or you? I love this. This guy is no different than anyone else. He comes in discussions with personal comments and when you reciprocate back he whines about your character and not his own rofl

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Yes and I've been quoting them and responding. Now, rather than blame me for misunderstanding perhaps you see now that I quoted you verbatim you can humble yourself for a change and see that you were wrong

Just a thought, because you can click the quote button, does not mean you understand what was said.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by crakjak

Just a thought, because you can click the quote button, does not mean you understand what was said.

Yes, actually it does. Would you like me to break down what you posted by pronoun, nouns, subject and object?