Not fully saying I agree with the premise presented in this argument, but for the sake of discussion I'd like to follow it through. Why would it break his heart? I believe babies are before the age of accountability, so the baby would be with the Lord eternally, in no pain, at peace, and in the presence of rejoicing. God sees the big picture, therefore I God justily knows that for a baby to leave suffering of this world is actually better for the baby.
Secondly, there are many things that God would love to do, but doesn't because he's not invited to do them. God is a gentleman. I believe He actually said that His will is that none perish... but He won't force rescue on anyone.
I don't read anywhere that a door is opened... even if they never knock, or that answers are ever found... even if they never search... or that it's given... if they never ask.
OK, you have a point there. From God's point of view, a dead baby is a good thing, indeed. (But nobody is supposed to carry that logic through to its only possible conclusion: that it is good to kill babies. Please. Don't.)
How about a sick adult? Did God let my brother die of cancer because He never heard a request for healing, or because He wanted him to die?
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
OK, you have a point there. From God's point of view, a dead baby is a good thing, indeed. (But nobody is supposed to carry that logic through to its only possible conclusion: that it is good to kill babies. Please. Don't.)
How about a sick adult? Did God let my brother die of cancer because He never heard a request for healing, or because He wanted him to die?
And that modification to the original premise is really why I was hesitant about following the logic all the way through. That is actually a different premise, and honestly one that I don't find an answer to in the Word of God.
When we begin to build doctrines and teachings from the Word, we have to be careful of the antithesis statement that doctrine is also making so that we can follow it all the way through. Where Bro. Jay stated earlier that someone has to ask, I don't see that in the Scriptures.
The principle that I see in Scripture is that if we do ask, it shall be given, if we do seek, we shall find, etc. But to push that to the conclusion that if nothing's ever asked for it won't be done is taking the Scriptures way beyond what they are saying. I think we have to take them at face value.... that asking makes a huge difference.
In the end, we all know that God has worked in many of our lives in situations we didn't even know we needed to ask for anything yet... kept back situations we weren't even aware of... so I can't see anything in the Word that says, healings may be withheld just because you didn't ask.
And that modification to the original premise is really why I was hesitant about following the logic all the way through. That is actually a different premise, and honestly one that I don't find an answer to in the Word of God.
When we begin to build doctrines and teachings from the Word, we have to be careful of the antithesis statement that doctrine is also making so that we can follow it all the way through. Where Bro. Jay stated earlier that someone has to ask, I don't see that in the Scriptures.
The principle that I see in Scripture is that if we do ask, it shall be given, if we do seek, we shall find, etc. But to push that to the conclusion that if nothing's ever asked for it won't be done is taking the Scriptures way beyond what they are saying. I think we have to take them at face value.... that asking makes a huge difference.
In the end, we all know that God has worked in many of our lives in situations we didn't even know we needed to ask for anything yet... kept back situations we weren't even aware of... so I can't see anything in the Word that says, healings may be withheld just because you didn't ask.
2 Ye lust, and have not: ye kill, and desire to have, and cannot obtain: ye fight and war, yet ye have not, because ye ask not. 3 Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.
Which also handily explains why we sometimes don't get what we ask for: we ask "amiss". Any thoughts on that?
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
2 Ye lust, and have not: ye kill, and desire to have, and cannot obtain: ye fight and war, yet ye have not, because ye ask not. 3 Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.
Which also handily explains why we sometimes don't get what we ask for: we ask "amiss". Any thoughts on that?
This Scripture unfortunately is proof texted so many times, and taken out of the context of the overall thought that James is trying to relay. James is talking about where our confidence, and our trust is. He talks about all the warring, and effort and striving we have for the things we desire, and all that effort so many times ends up in nothing but our frustration and still wanting.... when if we would just lay our desires, wants, needs, and cares with the Lord... we will find solice in laying our cares at the feet of the Lord.
If anyone takes James to be saying, the whole reason you are in lack is because you haven't hit the formula right in how you ask, or because you didn't ask, then they are taking this Scripture totally out of it's context and therefore proof texting it.
James is writing to some people that have issues obviously with depending on their flesh rather than God. These particular verses you note would be best incapsulated by the old song line, "...oh what peace we often forfeit, oh what needless pain we bare. All because we do not carry, everything to God in prayer..."
Hybrid Mode
