Homosexuality question

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

I don't think it is very hard to figure out sin. A motivated person (a fully determined person) is going to find deliverance. That means for the duration, however long that is for the person, they are going to see it through until deliverance comes. The Bible fully supports that view. We can find deliverance and live as overcomers.

It is not hard to figure out, for any type of sin committed, sometimes the struggle to continue and the struggle to give up can be enormous at times. It's almost like dieting - some fluctuate, and some make it a lifestyle and never gain the weight back.

We see people move on and away from sin knowing it could always be a temptation in their life. They prepare themselves to be keenly aware of the avenue or door. For instance, a person who has committed and repented of adultery would be keenly aware of how to not allow that sin to enter into their life again. They don't set themselves up for it. Don't talk to the opposite sex privately, don't share personal conversations with the opposite sex, etc.

The born gay thing is a fallacy. Logically, without even using the Bible as a tool, we can use science:

Let's start with genetic succession - one gay man/woman + one gay man/woman = no children. If gays cannot have children, how can they pass their genes on to children? There is no mechanism for gays to do that - scientifically.

A friend of mine witnessed to someone at work who was gay. The person said their psychologist told them they were born that way. The person said they had never heard they could obtain deliverance. They wanted out for years, but thought it was a done deal, according to the secular world.

The fact remains - there are people who have not been able to overcome sexual sins, so we want to say they are born that way in order to make sense of it. The sense of it is that there are just people who are not going to be overcomers - period.

And for those that feel they haven't been able to overcome - it's not over until the dirt is thrown down on your coffin. Or, as the old adage says, "it's not over until the fat lady sings."

Are you saying that you have made the choice to never sin again? That you have successfully overcome every bastion of sinful sexual desire and/or expression?

My, I know that I have a body. It has hormones a genetic make up yadda, yadda, yadda. I know that my hormone levels wax and wane and sometimes that "chemistry" can become a blazing fire of desire and irritability. I don't deny that my flesh as a life of it's own. And I don't deny that the battle will continue until this flesh is DEAD. I will have good days, bad days, days of victory, and days of defeat wherein I've succumbed to those desires. I do pray that my victories outnumber my defeats. And I've noticed that with age... this flesh becomes more mellow as it relates to certain desires. As a young man... I was a tiger, ready to go in an instant. Grrrr. But today... I have to think about it a little and more and more I'm discovering that I have to get the crank started. lol

It amazes me how older saints forget the power of hormones and biology.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Are you saying that you have made the choice to never sin again? That you have successfully overcome every bastion of sinful sexual desire and/or expression?

My, I know that I have a body. It has hormones a genetic make up yadda, yadda, yadda. I know that my hormone levels wax and wane and sometimes that "chemistry" can become a blazing fire of desire and irritability. I don't deny that my flesh as a life of it's own. And I don't deny that the battle will continue until this flesh is DEAD. I will have good days, bad days, days of victory, and days of defeat wherein I've succumbed to those desires. I do pray that my victories outnumber my defeats. And I've noticed that with age... this flesh becomes more mellow as it relates to certain desires. As a young man... I was a tiger, ready to go in an instant. Grrrr. But today... I have to think about it a little and more and more I'm discovering that I have to get the crank started. lol

It amazes me how older saints forget the power of hormones and biology.

Of course I am not saying that I have successfully overcome every bastion of sin in my life. Of course I would make a choice to never sin again? That isn't your choice? I'm not going to worry about what sin will try to tempt me because of any weakness in my flesh. I'm going to first and foremost determine to be an overcomer.

Aside from even a hormonal issue, I believe there are particular people you meet in life that you have an instant chemistry with. We have to be like Joseph and let them have your cloak and run like the dickens. If Joseph could do it, why can we be expected to do the same?

Honestly, I have been tempted one time in my Christian life. I was surprised by it. It came out of nowhere and at the right time when I very low and very unhappy. If God had not come to me every day, I may not have been an overcomer. But, He showed me His love and I wanted that more.

So, from that experience, I found out that if in your heart, you don't really want that sin, even though tempted by it, you will find a way of escape. At least, that was my experience.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Of course I am not saying that I have successfully overcome every bastion of sin in my life.

Do you believe that the very same patience, grace, and mercy extended to you will be extended to the believer who is homosexual?

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Do you believe that the very same patience, grace, and mercy extended to you will be extended to the believer who is homosexual?

Of course, if you are meaning a "believer" as someone recognizing their weakness without acting upon it. Just because you believe in God doesn't make you saved. Obedience makes and keeps us saved. That is a true believer.

If I have a weakness for fornication, but don't act upon it. The weakness isn't my sin. Acting upon would be. It's the same thing for a homosexual or any other sin we have a weakness for.

You've heard that a bird can fly over your head, but you don't have to allow it to build a nest. Our thoughts are not sinful, dwelling on them and then acting upon them is the sin.