Why did Jesus come and die? What he was doing on that cross anyway? If there was nothing to save humanity from, then why would he have done such a thing?
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Originally Posted by Timmy
Do you have a reason for me to believe that?
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Originally Posted by shazeep
Imo, and wadr, i think i might have a better one:
See, T, it's all in there; just no one can read it without Word.
Grape juice (water) just will not get you there.
It's all staring us right in the face.
btw, iow. Ttfn.
Quote:
Originally Posted by shazeep
Grape juice, new wine, old wine.
Water, spirit, fire.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timmy
The question was "Do you have a reason for me to believe that?" I know (or think!) she was just being funny, but EB's "who cares" is, well, typical EB. He doesn't care if I believe or not. He feels superior, as he has special knowledge that I don't, and he thinks it's a laughing matter that (according to him) I'll burn in hell forever -- for not believing him (even though he's not offering me a reason to believe him).
And he is solidifying my belief that there is no reason. No Christian I have ever asked has given me one.
Western Christianity has accepted a death-centric model of Christ, Timmy, and you are, naturally, looking to Established Religion, or The Beast, to provide the imprimatur of God for you, when you already know better yourself, wadr.
If Love your neighbor fulfills the Law and Prophets, then worshipping Christ lifted up like a snake on a pole has a different meaning than the one that the blind will read, until they get Word. The relevant passage has two verses, John 3:14, 15, and i give you a link to the God's Word Translation, because as you will see in many other translations (KJV excluded), the verse is written differently. http://biblehub.com/gwt/john/3.htm
Now, this is not the best way to bring you to an understanding of why Christ must be lifted up like a snake on a pole; we are going the direct route here, going right to the conclusion. But the point for now is that there is a very good reason that these two verses are separated, that being because v 15 is deliberately worded in such a way so as to be read one way by the worshippers of Nehushtan {the snake on a pole made of brass, that the Israelites went back to worshipping in the PromLand, that was finally broken into pieces, Timmy, by i think it was Hezekiah, i neglected to look
He removed the high places, smashed the sacred stones and cut down the Asherah poles. He broke into pieces the bronze snake Moses had made, for up to that time the Israelites had been burning incense to it. (It was called Nehushtan.)
but you can look if you want}, and read another way by the followers of Christ, ok. So don't be looking for any Western Christian's take on Christ, Timmy, you are strictly wasting your time. You are asking the snake how to find Jesus, Timmy, and i truly mean no offense to anyone here, and God does not condemn anyone, either, it is just that you turned down the hippie that came at you first, with his offer of Free Love, because after all, he did not sound as serious as God must surely want a seeker to be, right? Even if the little children loved him...so, Christ must be lifted up like a snake on a pole. Then everyone who believes in him will have eternal life. Two diff things goin on. http://biblehub.com/gwt/john/3.htm
ok?
And, since i guess calling people Nehushtan worshippers sounds bad, it should be remembered that these people left Egypt as free men, and are just still beholden to servants, even though they are the heirs. Meaning that it is just another path that people take, no better or worse, and you are likely just suffering the blanket condemnation that comes from them, Timmy, not Christ, Who plainly states that I came not to condemn.
The only, only, only commandment that God requires of anyone, ever, is that they reap what they sow, Timmy. As evidenced IRL. You must reap what you sow. And even that has been made into some dire doomsday yack; because if you go and sow great things, you will reap what you sow. See, the focus is shifted, in a death-centered model, for purposes of control, etc, Empire-Building, and you are asking one of the 3 legs of the Evil King how to find Christ, ok. And i have plenty of Witness to back that up if you need it.
Now that does not mean that the people involved are not decent people; they either are, or they are not.
But it does mean that the more you recognize that Breath-of-God, Word, Christ, Gospel, are what matters, the easier it is to see with eyes that allow you to know where a person is by how they interpret Scripture. And that is all Scripture is for, basically; to divide joints from marrow, that a person's heart may be judged. If someone condemns, they are outside of God's Will, it is just that simple. You do not condemn a little child in a group of little children for loudly proclaiming their understanding--got from mom--of where babies come from; nor do you condemn a child for sticking their hand in a fire. It is a part of life, that we forget when we stop being little children, and start adulting.
Don't be deceived, little children; those who do right, are right.
The question was "Do you have a reason for me to believe that?" I know (or think!) she was just being funny, but EB's "who cares" is, well, typical EB. He doesn't care if I believe or not. He feels superior, as he has special knowledge that I don't, and he thinks it's a laughing matter that (according to him) I'll burn in hell forever -- for not believing him (even though he's not offering me a reason to believe him).
And he is solidifying my belief that there is no reason. No Christian I have ever asked has given me one.
If I had a dollar for everytime someone performs pyschological projecting on a forum I'd be rich!
It is you who feels superior to us cave dwellers, you are the one who broke free. Therefore, you beat your chest and post your best. All this repeats itself over and over again. Whether it is the liberal who leaves the conservative, or the Theist who becomes a Atheist. While some have better things to do with their new found lifestyle, others sit in their underwear while typing away on how those they left behind need to be brought to their light.
Burn in hell for not believing me? Dude, then if that was true, I would of been posting like it was a job to prove to you that it would happen. But I know you, you aren't a atheist, you are a whiner. My father was an atheist, and while there wasn't internet forums in his time, he wasn't whining to anyone. He sure wasn't hunting Theists down to ask them questions, or act arrogant when someone couldn't answer a question. Timmy, I rarely have respect for any joker who trolls a Christian or theist forum. My man, you have been a 24kt gold sniveler from jump street. Supposed to have a burden for lost souls, not lost trolls. Big difference.
__________________ "all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed."
~Declaration of Independence
Last edited by Evang.Benincasa; 11-08-2016 at 08:57 PM.
you should prolly trust him, T, after all, he represents the government, and surely has your best interests at heart. He only condemns you to help you, don't you know. If you asked him nicely, surely he would assure you of where the Word is, that you need to hear, since he knows. So of course he commands the respect of men, for this, and you have not recognized his authoritay, Mr T. So of course you will be punished, accused, condemned.
__________________ "all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed."
~Declaration of Independence
Because i saw the deception in the Book, T, it's right in there, God~Breathed, staring us all in the face. Right in the face. I saw why Priests were getting accused of being drunk in the morning. But you ask why i believe, and you didn't ask what i believe, so you still got kind of a not very good answer there, because it seems you are asking me why i am still religious, and so i gave the best answer i could to that, from that perspective, when knowing what i believe would have you in agreement with me, and you wouldn't even be asking why then, ok.
Have you seen the video i posted, around here somewhere, of the moose, sniffing the arrow that might kill him? You can prolly search those words and find it. The moose has a veil over his eyes, and you can see the veil yourself, T. Take the veil off, and you can see. But i would count the cost there, because you can't unsee, i guess, and you will become a pariah, ok. And i don't mean 'to clowns,' i mean to everyone. i guess.
<edit>
Oh, but i don't mean to suggest fear; i might be shortly staying under a bridge again, but i'm totally at peace now. Just no one else around me is, i guess.
of the moose, sniffing the arrow that might kill him?
Really?
I bet that'll get Timmy boy speaking in tongues.
__________________ "all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed."
~Declaration of Independence
Ezekiel 12:2
"Son of man, you live in the midst of the rebellious house, who have eyes to see but do not see, ears to hear but do not hear; for they are a rebellious house.
Ephraim is the prodigal nation who calls the Torah a strange thing, they have thrown off the Torah as they became as a dead man.
I didn't read the part about Ephraim that Daq wrote, but I can tell you that Ephraim symbolizes the flesh and it's my opinion that you walk 42 months in Ephraim and he is a gentile, a gentile who wants to remain gentile{But he needs to die} When he reads anything, he doesn't know what he is reading because he only sees the flesh, he calls the Torah a strange thing and the Torah has always been hidden from most because they are blind and instead of seeing a marriage contract, they see a list of dos and don't's from an angry God but God has always told them they wouldn't be able to read it, and that the point was never to sacrifice, but to learn who and what you are, and that you are an animal who needs God.
Most People read the Torah just as Israel had read and not understood.
Matthew 13:13
This is why I speak to them in parables: 'Though seeing, they do not see; though hearing, they do not hear or understand.'
Matthew 13:14
In them the prophecy of Isaiah is fulfilled: 'You will be ever hearing but never understanding; you will be ever seeing but never perceiving.
Acts 28:26
Go to this people and say, "You will be ever hearing but never understanding; you will be ever seeing but never perceiving."
Acts 28:27
For this people's heart has grown callous; they hardly hear with their ears, and they have closed their eyes. Otherwise they might see with their eyes, hear with their ears, understand with their hearts, and turn, and I would heal them.'
Romans 11:8
as it is written: "God gave them a spirit of stupor, eyes that could not see, and ears that could not hear, to this very day."
Isaiah 6:9
He said, "Go, and tell this people: 'Keep on listening, but do not perceive; Keep on looking, but do not understand.'
Isaiah 6:10
"Render the hearts of this people insensitive, Their ears dull, And their eyes dim, Otherwise they might see with their eyes, Hear with their ears, Understand with their hearts, And return and be healed."
Ezekiel 12:2
"Son of man, you live in the midst of the rebellious house, who have eyes to see but do not see, ears to hear but do not hear; for they are a rebellious house.
A person will either see wonder and beauty, or he will see evil, chains and horror.
Maybe a day will one day come when eyes have been opened and ears have been opened?
My theory is, see, that if you get hold of someone early enough, or maybe if they're scared enough, of whatever, just scared, fearful types, tending toward silent hysteria, you know, glued to the news, and moved by it, the veil gets really heavy, like cemented in, and when someone, some guy in a tie, successful, you know, comes along, with a confident smile and a contract he signed for Jesus, this guy (6), and his contract, 501 (6), c3 (6), well, they just appear like...i dunno, an angel of light or something, and scared people just reach out and grab that anchor with all their might, and shut their eyes tight, so tight they can't even read, the Book that has become their god, because they got the word, and are now assured, done looking, done seeking, they have found the Promland, had one swear that to me today, they have followed the pointed finger to the mansion in the sky, somewhen, and they believe it, and they don't doubt the Book for a second, because they can't read It to see that they are in There, being described right in There, the ones that ate and drank in His Presence, the workers of iniquity, right there in plain English, μισθός ἀδικίας , depriving another of what is his now, Babbeling yack they have no Witness for, and pointing fingers at Atheists, and God.
love how Greek got put right next to "plain English" there, priceless, lol. wish i could take the credit.
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