Submission? Or Power and Control?

[houston]

I'm sorry. The hair was placed over prayer requests at an Alabama ladies retreat.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Amanah

If there is false doctrine being taught, then it is good to see what the bible actually teaches and hold fast to that, and refute error.

Right, that is what we have been trying to discuss, and why I asked for respectful dialogue. That is the point that ILG was making.

Contentious issues have always been discussed on FCF, NFCF, and AFF. FCF was a much better forum as people DID have respectful and intelligent dialogue. It wasn't a bunch of insults and GIF's. And there were a lot more posters because of that.

But to say that because a few are teaching incorrectly that a whole organization should be discounted is cutting to deeply with possible serious repercussions, and possibly souls at stake.

I don't believe anyone was taking that view. I don't believe that is the stance that ILG is taking either. I see a lot of value in the UPCI.

I am not here to defend an organization per se. I spent the majority of my walk with the Lord in an independent Apostolic Church, before joining a UPC church.

Right, you didn't spend the "majority" of your time in the UPCI and so....

Originally Posted by houston

Let's not act like this is done in a dark corner somewhere unbeknown to the leadership in the UPCI. It is the UPCI website where a pic was retrieved of a woman letting down her uncut hair to pray over the offering plate.

LS spread this junk all over the USA and around the world. He doesn't have a small following.

Thank you, true.

Originally Posted by houston

I'm sorry. The hair was placed over prayer requests at an Alabama ladies retreat.

Thank you, true.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Right, that is what we have been trying to discuss, and why I asked for respectful dialogue. That is the point that ILG was making.

Contentious issues have always been discussed on FCF, NFCF, and AFF. FCF was a much better forum as people DID have respectful and intelligent dialogue. It wasn't a bunch of insults and GIF's. And there were a lot more posters because of that.

There was a lot more posters because Facebook wasn't around.
Respectful dialogue? Eh, no. FCF was definitely very good while Brother Yohe was alive. Haters were slim to none. But when his sister took over from Brother Mike Fleming then we really had haters at the gate. Blue Denim Whales? Seriously? Bundaged? Oh, yes it was light fun and sweet fellowship.

My foot.

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

I don't believe anyone was taking that view. I don't believe that is the stance that ILG is taking either. I see a lot of value in the UPCI.

You don't believe that she is taking that view? Well, I believe she is taking that view. Also others were led to believe she was taking that view. Go back to the original post, it isn't dealing with a bunch of verses. It is dealing with UPCI material written by UPCI authors. I have people in our church who wouldn't know Brother Lee Stoneking if he fell on them. Listen this may come as a shock, but not everyone who says Lord Lord are, or were ever UPC.

This whole attacking or defending the UPCI gets a little old.

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Right, you didn't spend the "majority" of your time in the UPCI and so....

So much for respectful dialogue.

Meaning we who are independent Apostolics really have no skin in the game. Other than you all wanting to debate the scriptures. Bringing up the UPC material is all ILG issues, not ours. I never believed that everytime a bell rang an angel gots his wings, Neither have a lot of people here who are, were, or never were UPCI. So, if she had a hard row to hoe at the UPCI I don't know how that's my fault or my church families fault. She isn't here to glean manna, because she has stated that she knows all the arguments and were wrong and she is going to heaven with her own press club. Hooray.

It's old, typing out pages and pages of information to have disgruntled with a made up mind blow their nose with it. Seriously?

[ILG]

Originally Posted by houston

I'm sorry. The hair was placed over prayer requests at an Alabama ladies retreat.

And this is why I write what I do. This should be denounced from the higher ups, but it is ever?

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by houston

I'm sorry. The hair was placed over prayer requests at an Alabama ladies retreat.

Therefore every United Pentecostal in Alabama believes this?

Again, the point of this argument is that the organization has no position on this. End of story. If anyone was to take the organization to court trying to prove that the ORGANIZATION believed this as a tenent. We would be hard pressed to get a case going.

[ILG]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Therefore every United Pentecostal in Alabama believes this?

Again, the point of this argument is that the organization has no position on this. End of story. If anyone was to take the organization to court trying to prove that the ORGANIZATION believed this as a tenent. We would be hard pressed to get a case going.

The organization doesn't preach against it because they don't want to dismantle their own stance even if it is false doctrine. It should be easy to teach against this. Instead, they leave it up to us "backslid heathen" to do it.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by ILG

The organization doesn't preach against it because they don't want to dismantle their own stance even if it is false doctrine.

A conspiracy theory?

Sorry sis, that's too funny.

The paramount issue is that the UPCI has NO OFFICIAL STATEMENT that you can control the migration paths of angels with hair. You have no argument, no case can be brought to law. Brother Stoneking can preach that dolphins escape from Atlantis when PeePaw gets a haircut. Yet, you would be unable to pin the tail on the UPCI as a whole. Sorry, no cigar, and you don't win a box of cookies.

Originally Posted by ILG

It should be easy to teach against this. Instead, they leave it up to us "backslid heathen" to do it.

So, your beef is that an organization has to make a formal announcement against this, and you will come back to the UPCI?

Why are you saying backslid heathen? What is that supposed to do for your message?

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by ILG

The organization doesn't preach against it because they don't want to dismantle their own stance even if it is false doctrine. It should be easy to teach against this. Instead, they leave it up to us "backslid heathen" to do it.

Organizations don't preach. Men do. And most men don't preach against HMH because its such an outlier, its like expecting an organizational decree regarding flat earth.

Again, I've been around apostolics from one coast to the other and in between, and never even heard of this stuff until these forums. Never even heard of it back in the days of Delphi forums, either.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Organizations don't preach. Men do. And most men don't preach against HMH because its such an outlier, its like expecting an organizational decree regarding flat earth.

Again, I've been around apostolics from one coast to the other and in between, and never even heard of this stuff until these forums. Never even heard of it back in the days of Delphi forums, either.

I can't say the same, but I can say that it is a mixed bag.

Again, the organization has no statement saying that they believe it.
Many ministers don't believe it, and are vocal against it.

[ILG]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Organizations don't preach. Men do. And most men don't preach against HMH because its such an outlier, its like expecting an organizational decree regarding flat earth.

Again, I've been around apostolics from one coast to the other and in between, and never even heard of this stuff until these forums. Never even heard of it back in the days of Delphi forums, either.

The people who have been harmed by this teaching are all over. If you listen.