Can God?

[RevDWW]

Originally Posted by Timmy

I was baptized "in the titles", years ago.


Yes. I spoke in tongues. But it wasn't the HG speaking through me. I learned how to do it by watching others, like all the other kids around that altar. Fooled everyone. The initial "evidence" didn't serve the purpose of real evidence, did it? Can you tell when someone gets it for real?



Not really. Placebos can do amazing things. Even OPs know that.



Power? Like they're talking about in the thread Do "OPs" Really Have More Power than other Christians? Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems that most don't think so. You'd think since they get it right, God would honor their faith more than anyone else's.



And this would glorify God.... how?

A church I used to attend sent a missions team to Mexico. Came home with a picture of a little girl, standing up from her wheelchair, face beaming. Congregation loved it. But do you think that little girl is now running and playing with her friends? Think how she and her parents must feel about those Americans and the "God" they preached about. Are they "no worse off"? Is false hope better than no hope?



I have, thanks.

Please understand I was not attacking you in the least. If you got that out of my posts then I am truly sorry. I meant every word with the sincere love of Christ. Posted words don't work near as well for me as the spoken word.

So you think none of this can be true, because you and other youngsters faked it as kids?

Being baptized in the titles is as great as those that were baptized into Johns baptism, yet when they heard the Message they were baptized again calling on the name of the Lord?

Timmy, I pray God's great blessings for you and yours!

[Timmy]

Originally Posted by RevDWW

Please understand I was not attacking you in the least. If you got that out of my posts then I am truly sorry.

Oh, I didn't, not at all! No need to apologize.

Originally Posted by RevDWW

I meant every word with the sincere love of Christ. Posted words don't work near as well for me as the spoken word.

So you think none of this can be true, because you and other youngsters faked it as kids?

Not just that. And actually, I don't think "none of this can be true". I'm somewhat open minded about it, but the overwhelming evidence I've seen is that it (that is, miracles, tongues, prophecy, etc.) is not literally true.

BTW, I would like to know: can you tell fake tongues from the real thing?

Originally Posted by RevDWW

Being baptized in the titles is as great as those that were baptized into Johns baptism, yet when they heard the Message they were baptized again calling on the name of the Lord?

Timmy, I pray God's great blessings for you and yours!

Thanks!

[RevDWW]

Originally Posted by Timmy

Oh, I didn't, not at all! No need to apologize.


Not just that. And actually, I don't think "none of this can be true". I'm somewhat open minded about it, but the overwhelming evidence I've seen is that it (that is, miracles, tongues, prophecy, etc.) is not literally true.

BTW, I would like to know: can you tell fake tongues from the real thing?



Thanks!

There are times when I feel I can discern the difference. But I'll leave that up to the Lord and the individual to work out. Now I have seen the real thing a few times. But I try never to tell anyone "You got it". If you have to tell them then there's some sort of issue there wouldn't you think?

Seriously, bad stuff goes on in the name of the miraculous, but that doesn't make Jesus any less powerful does it?

[Timmy]

Originally Posted by RevDWW

There are times when I feel I can discern the difference. But I'll leave that up to the Lord and the individual to work out. Now I have seen the real thing a few times. But I try never to tell anyone "You got it". If you have to tell them then there's some sort of issue there wouldn't you think?

Seriously, bad stuff goes on in the name of the miraculous, but that doesn't make Jesus any less powerful does it?

This gets right to the heart of my concerns. I have no problem with believing that God is powerful. It's silly to say otherwise. I mean, come on, he created the universe!

But it bothers me when "bad stuff" happens, like the fake healings and the false hope, and when exaggerations and lies are told about "miracles". When people are told they are healed, when they're not. When people are told the reason they weren't healed is their lack of faith, or hidden sin. Guilt trips and excuses. Nothing good comes out of this.

Now, can God do miracles today? I think so. But I also say he probably doesn't. Or if he does, it's very rare. But if it's rare, I have to wonder, what is the purpose of miracles? Is it to prove that he is powerful? Or to show us that he loves us? Then I think they'd be quite a bit more common. Consider the danger of thinking he does miracles for us because he loves us: when he (apparently) does something for us, we're happy. We say "Isn't God good? God really loves me!" But when he doesn't come through for us, why shouldn't we say "God isn't good", or "God doesn't love me"? Can't have it both ways!

It's more likely that he lets the laws of nature proceed, without much, if any, interference. I think I've heard a saying, something like God's hands are our hands. In other words, he works through us. Through doctors, teachers, ordinary people who love each other and help each other in times of need. We have each other -- we don't need a genie in a lamp!

[RevDWW]

Originally Posted by Timmy

This gets right to the heart of my concerns. I have no problem with believing that God is powerful. It's silly to say otherwise. I mean, come on, he created the universe!

But it bothers me when "bad stuff" happens, like the fake healings and the false hope, and when exaggerations and lies are told about "miracles". When people are told they are healed, when they're not. When people are told the reason they weren't healed is their lack of faith, or hidden sin. Guilt trips and excuses. Nothing good comes out of this.

Now, can God do miracles today? I think so. But I also say he probably doesn't. Or if he does, it's very rare. But if it's rare, I have to wonder, what is the purpose of miracles? Is it to prove that he is powerful? Or to show us that he loves us? Then I think they'd be quite a bit more common. Consider the danger of thinking he does miracles for us because he loves us: when he (apparently) does something for us, we're happy. We say "Isn't God good? God really loves me!" But when he doesn't come through for us, why shouldn't we say "God isn't good", or "God doesn't love me"? Can't have it both ways!

It's more likely that he lets the laws of nature proceed, without much, if any, interference. I think I've heard a saying, something like God's hands are our hands. In other words, he works through us. Through doctors, teachers, ordinary people who love each other and help each other in times of need. We have each other -- we don't need a genie in a lamp!

I have experienced the awesome power of God and know beyond a shadow of a doubt it's real. I have also seen the counterfeit and it's never really that close to the original. Sure it can get passed if attention is not being paid, but under close inspection the flaws show.