For those who want to know...RULES at my church!

[JaneEyre]

Originally Posted by The Mrs

I see it's the naysayers turn to voice their opinions and make light of something they really have no idea how hurtful and painful it really is.

It has been repeated over and over...if you haven't walked a mile in my shoes, you have no clue what you're talking about. In this case, that really does apply.

I always get irritated when I see posts that say, 'just walk', 'just leave', 'just go somewhere else'. Vote with your feet. I wish it were that simple, but it's not.

Unless you have been under spiritual abuse, or cult-like tendencies, you can't imagine how hard it really is. You don't 'just leave'. You are tied to that place and that leadership with only one thought in mind...your salvation is at stake. You HAVE to make it to heaven. And THIS is the ONLY WAY to get there. You are taught that there's no other way to be saved. I would NEVER risk my salvation like that.

You can't 'vote with your feet' unless you know it's wrong. Unless you've already had some exposure to it, you just don't realize it's wrong. NOW I know what to look for, and what to avoid...but I didn't THEN. I thought it was how everybody lived (inside the UPC of course).

People living under this kind of bondage lead very pain-filled lives. As witnessed in this thread alone, there were remarks made of suicide, or 'death thoughts'. I remember being one of those as well. You can't please the pastor, so you must not be pleasing God, so you start to think you would be better off dead, and wonder why God hasn't taken your life already. I remember several months that everytime I got in the car I expected to die in a crash.

When you first start realizing something's wrong, and you need to get out of there, you don't think about just going to the church next door. The only acceptable way for you to ever leave THAT CHURCH is if you move. So you start praying that God would give your husband a job opportunity in another city. Or another state. Or even in my case, another country. A job change is the ONLY acceptable reason, and even then it still has to be 'okayed' by the pastor. You still have to ask his permission. And he still has to consult with God about it, and will let you know the outcome.

I wish I could convey the hold this type of teaching has on a person...when you are constantly reminded of how your salvation is tied to this, you don't ever just walk away, or even dare to disagree.

I can tell from this post that you "have lived it"....Only someone who's been in this situation - someone's who's lived it can have these insights. Thanks, Sis. I wanted to type something like this but didn't take the time.

[rgcraig]

Originally Posted by JaneEyre

I can tell from this post that you "have lived it"....Only someone who's been in this situation - someone's who's lived it can have these insights. Thanks, Sis. I wanted to type something like this but didn't take the time.

You are right.

I am dissappointed that some here actually have said some of the things they have. Folks that come throught this and are still here to say to others "you can make it" should NOT have to put up with more abuse. Where's the compassion all around?

[JaneEyre]

Originally Posted by rgcraig

You are right.

I am dissappointed that some here actually have said some of the things they have. Folks that come throught this and are still here to say to others "you can make it" should NOT have to put up with more abuse. Where's the compassion all around?

Why are we blaming the victims? Exactly. Where IS the compassion?

[RandyWayne]

Originally Posted by JaneEyre

Why are we blaming the victims? Exactly. Where IS the compassion?

The concept of 'spiritual abuse' goes directly against the world view of those who believe in man-made "top down" view of religion. Meaning, pastor and his rules on top and the lay people on the bottom. That is simply "how it is!" to some. The pastor or organization will always be assumed innocent and the lay person will always be assumed guilty.

[rgcraig]

Originally Posted by RandyWayne

The concept of 'spiritual abuse' goes directly against the world view of those who believe in man-made "top down" view of religion. Meaning, pastor and his rules on top and the lay people on the bottom. That is simply "how it is!" to some. The pastor or organization will always be assumed innocent and the lay person will always be assumed guilty.

Originally Posted by rgcraig

Some of us have realized that the top bird doesn't have any way to prove why he gets to be the top bird other than that he felt like he should be...

[Jekyll]

Originally Posted by RandyWayne

The concept of 'spiritual abuse' goes directly against the world view of those who believe in man-made "top down" view of religion. Meaning, pastor and his rules on top and the lay people on the bottom. That is simply "how it is!" to some. The pastor or organization will always be assumed innocent and the lay person will always be assumed guilty.

So, what is a good definition of spiritual abuse?

[RandyWayne]

Originally Posted by Jekyll

So, what is a good definition of spiritual abuse?

If you start from the beginning of this thread, you will see it.

Originally Posted by RandyWayne

The concept of 'spiritual abuse' goes directly against the world view of those who believe in man-made "top down" view of religion. Meaning, pastor and his rules on top and the lay people on the bottom. That is simply "how it is!" to some. The pastor or organization will always be assumed innocent and the lay person will always be assumed guilty.

That is it....very good point

[JaneEyre]

Originally Posted by RandyWayne

The concept of 'spiritual abuse' goes directly against the world view of those who believe in man-made "top down" view of religion. Meaning, pastor and his rules on top and the lay people on the bottom. That is simply "how it is!" to some. The pastor or organization will always be assumed innocent and the lay person will always be assumed guilty.

Well, just as the Catholic Church is dealing with sexual abuse and it's real, I believe that spiritual abuse is just as real. Not many will admit that the body has the problem of spiritual abuse. The thinking is that "if we ignore the problem, it will not go away or if we don't talk about it, it will go away."

Also, I believe that most of the spiritual abuse I have seen has been done through ignorance. It was well-intentioned. This pastor that STS mentioned in her first post probably thought he had to "make the path so straight to line up the folks to keep them on track." His goal may have been to "get them to heaven" his way. Notice the little "h" in his. The path is straight. We're told that in the Bible - but we're not given all of these esoteric rules in the Bible.

People abuse their physical bodies through ignorance - as overeating, not exercising enough, etc. Much of the harm that comes to the body of Christ I believe is through ignorance and not knowing what to do for a healthy Church body.