Tiger Woods Update Thread

[notofworks]

Originally Posted by ManOfWord

Scammed is right. I along with many others thought he was something that he wasn't. If it were just a mistake, that's one thing. But it, apparently was a repeated lifestyle behavior.

You thought Tiger was a great golfer. He is, in fact, a great golfer. I don't see how you were scammed.

I didn't say there were MANY women. Don't appreciate you putting words in my mouth. I said more than one. Over the course of 25+ yrs of pastoring that is probably not abnormal. I'm not holier than others and certainly not holier than Tiger. Your gift of prophecy must be working well. You're right.....I have made mistakes...I am not perfect. However, I DO know what is important and he should have as well. Faithfulness to one's spouse should not be something abnormal. No excuse for what he did no matter what you say. A single indiscretion is completely different from what he has done. It is what it is and he CAN be forgiven and restored as I have said. I pray for that to happen.

"Many"....."More than one"....I'll let you parse the words. It's all relative. Some would believe "more than one" to be "Many." Since you've made mistakes, committed sins, and had lapses in judgment, as has Tiger, why don't you leave it at that and only pray for him, rather than announcing what he deserves. Again, Lamentations 3:22.

I have no intention of piling on the stones on some web site solely for the purpose of destruction. I'm not yelling at him AND I don't use vulgarities. That is not what this thread is about either. I am expressing my opinion. I am simply looking at both sides of the equation. If it were me, I'd say the same thing. No candy coating. No smoke and mirrors. Sin, especially THIS sin is ugly and unfortunately, in the face of everyone. It speaks to the very core of man's character....faithfulness to the one you have chosen to spend the rest of your life with. This man practices day in and day out to put the little white ball in the little cup. He says "NO" to so many things which vie for his attention away from that. Don't tell me with a straight face that he didn't have the constitution to remain faithful to Elin. He chose where his victories were and one of the things which REALLY matter, he chose not to. It is forgivable, but unacceptable.

Yes, he failed. He could have avoided it, but he didn't. You, as well, could have avoided every sin you've ever committed. But you didn't. You and Tiger are the same in that respect. You've probably behaved better than he. Good for you. But you both need God's grace. For all have sinned (past tense) and come short (present tense) of the glory of God.

I pray as well that the Sovereign Lord will hear Tiger's cries and prayers and heal his marriage and draw him to Him who is able to restore. That does not negate the facts of what I have stated.....fair and balanced!

To be fair and balanced, it should be made clear that your depravity, without God's grace, is just like Tiger's.

I hope you still like it when "Iron sharpens iron", although you may not considered me to be "iron"!

[ManOfWord]

Originally Posted by notofworks

To be fair and balanced, it should be made clear that your depravity, without God's grace, is just like Tiger's.

I hope you still like it when "Iron sharpens iron", although you may not considered me to be "iron"!

No, I didn't' think Tiger was a great golfer. Everyone knew that he was. Most of us thought he was a "good guy" when it came to his family. I would never expect perfection. I WOULD expect faithfulness to Elin, as did she, as did most, and I assume YOU as well.

I also have no problem whatsoever stating in clarity that my depravity, without God's grace deserves an horrible pit. But He, through His blood has promised me a heavenly place. However, because of his larger than life, life and his apparent, good family man personna, we all expected more and that expectation is not unreasonable. It is expected of ALL leaders. There are certain things you can't get away with when it comes to leadership. Those who fail to realize that, IMO, are in danger of repeating them.

A leader can make many mistakes which will not ruin his leadership. He can have a slip of the tongue; file taxes late; make a less than stellar decision, misjudge a situation; loose his temper etc. But when a leader makes such an egregious error in judgment, which goes to the very core of his ability to lead, that is keeping his word, that "Titanic" is going down. That is not a criticism of the man. That is simply the way leadership works.

You continually fail to mention the GOOD things I have stated regarding this situation. I didn't stop at the good things because of the reality. No fear in stating truth. I have not judged him. I have only said what I would say if I were in his shoes. Accepting responsibility is what big boys do. Generals well understand that as do presidents and kings etc.

Pro. 6:32 But a man who commits adultery lacks judgment; whoever does so destroys himself. 33 Blows and disgrace are his lot, and his shame will never be wiped away;

The balance is this: Jn. 6:37 All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out.

[notofworks]

Originally Posted by ManOfWord

No, I didn't' think Tiger was a great golfer. Everyone knew that he was. Most of us thought he was a "good guy" when it came to his family. I would never expect perfection. I WOULD expect faithfulness to Elin, as did she, as did most, and I assume YOU as well.

I'll admit, I'm surprised at what has taken place. And because I have a son that has, from the time he was small, prayed for Tiger to come to faith in Christ, we are both heartbroken at what has occurred, and hopeful that this will allow him to realize he needs something more than his own strength, talent, and discipline.

Yes, I would have hoped that he would be faithful, but I also know that rock stars, actors, and athletes face sexual temptations to extents that you and I will never comprehend. I'd like to think I would pass the test. But honestly, none of us could know for sure until we were in that place. I hope by God's grace, I would. But I also hope that if I blew it, even repeatedly as Tiger did, that there would be a place of shelter and safety for me.

I also have no problem whatsoever stating in clarity that my depravity, without God's grace deserves an horrible pit. But He, through His blood has promised me a heavenly place. However, because of his larger than life, life and his apparent, good family man personna, we all expected more and that expectation is not unreasonable. It is expected of ALL leaders. There are certain things you can't get away with when it comes to leadership. Those who fail to realize that, IMO, are in danger of repeating them.

I don't see Tiger as a leader of anything besides tournament leader boards and PGA Tour money lists. Your remarks concerning leaders would seem to apply to everyone.

A leader can make many mistakes which will not ruin his leadership. He can have a slip of the tongue; file taxes late; make a less than stellar decision, misjudge a situation; loose his temper etc. But when a leader makes such an egregious error in judgment, which goes to the very core of his ability to lead, that is keeping his word, that "Titanic" is going down. That is not a criticism of the man. That is simply the way leadership works.

Again, what you're saying about leaders applies to everyone.

Tiger himself said, "I may not be able to repair the damage I've done." He knows how bad this is and he knows it MUCH better than any of us who are on the internet typing gibberish. It's theory to us, but it's real for him and his family. I think it's notable that he has not hired a PR crisis management firm to help. He's going with his heart and I think that's a great start.

You continually fail to mention the GOOD things I have stated regarding this situation. I didn't stop at the good things because of the reality. No fear in stating truth. I have not judged him. I have only said what I would say if I were in his shoes. Accepting responsibility is what big boys do. Generals well understand that as do presidents and kings etc.

The good things you say are always followed by, "But....". Like I said when this all started, "If you'd just stopped after the first paragraph."

I don't understand why we all need to point pout the obvious. Galatians 5 says, "The works of the flesh are evident" or "obvious." We all know what he did wrong and we all know how terrible it is. So does Tiger. Why do we feel the need to come here and throw our hat into the ring of announcing his wrongs? What more is there to say than, "Oh God!! Help him! Please!"? Is there really anything else to say?

Pro. 6:32 But a man who commits adultery lacks judgment; whoever does so destroys himself. 33 Blows and disgrace are his lot, and his shame will never be wiped away;

"He forgave all your sin. He canceled the record that contained the charges against us. He took it and destroyed it by nailing it to Christ's cross." Colossians 2:14-15.

Jesus bore not only our sin but our shame as well.

The balance is this: Jn. 6:37 All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out.

I and my family are praying that he will come to the Father. And in the midst of the prayers, there seems to be nothing else to say.

[ManOfWord]

Originally Posted by notofworks

I and my family are praying that he will come to the Father. And in the midst of the prayers, there seems to be nothing else to say.

What you may fail to realize is that this place is a discussion board. We discuss things here. We discuss the good, the bad and the ugly. It is not a one dimensional "Pollyannic" only say the good things discussion board. You're absolutely right that I have said the good things and then, "But." That is because the "but" exists. Sorry if you don't like the fact that the bad along with the good gets "bytes." It is the reality you don't seem to take too well to around here. I dare say that we are a far cry from the web site you unwisely mentioned here that is trashing him. No one has trashed him here, IMO. We have been discussing the reality of his public life and his indiscretions.

I pray that he not only restores his marriage but that he can become an example of what can happen when one determines to make things right. He has the ability.....if he trusts in the One who gave him his talent. Let's see what an "athlete" he can be in that area. I pray that he gets the "trophy."

[notofworks]

Originally Posted by ManOfWord

What you may fail to realize is that this place is a discussion board. We discuss things here. We discuss the good, the bad and the ugly.

And what you fail to realize is that I am discussing things here. Do I not have the right to do that? You are expressing an opinion and so am I. Are you the only one who gets to do that? Please allow me to express my opinion without announcing that I fail to realize that AFF has discussions.

It is the reality you don't seem to take too well to around here.

Really? Would you like me to leave? Am I too difficult for you? I thought you like "iron sharpening iron." What you fail to realize is, that around here, we have discussions!

I dare say that we are a far cry from the web site you unwisely mentioned here that is trashing him.

Seriously? That was unwise? Surely you jest. What was unwise about me mentioning tigerwoods.com? If you're serious, you completely lost me.

No one has trashed him here, IMO. We have been discussing the reality of his public life and his indiscretions.

I disagree (shocker, huh?)Posting pictures of him beat up with his wife holding a golf club and saying it's their Christmas card is trashing him. Posting numerous jokes about his sin is trashing him.

I pray that he not only restores his marriage but that he can become an example of what can happen when one determines to make things right. He has the ability.....if he trusts in the One who gave him his talent. Let's see what an "athlete" he can be in that area. I pray that he gets the "trophy."

Now we can hold hands and sing "Kum ba yah" on that statement!!!

Well, for anyone who thinks all we ex-upcers are just alike, I guess we're provin'em wrong!!