Charismatic Bishop In Lawsuit.

[rgcraig]

Originally Posted by Berkley

Renda,
I agree, in part. Many men on the down low do not identify as gay, or homosexual. There are different reasons that a man has sex with another man. Physical attraction doesn't have to be one of them. Some do it for a no strings attached release. Others were sexually abused at a young age, and they may act out in this perverse manner because it gives them a sense of control over the situation.

I understand the term. I think it would be better to say they want to appear straight.

[DAII]

Originally Posted by rgcraig

I understand the term. I think it would be better to say they want to appear straight.

Or maybe bi?

[ManOfWord]

Originally Posted by Mr. Smith

The problem is, BT, race was NEVER mentioned in this thread, or anywhere else I've seen or heard the Long issue discussed. Honestly, it's never crossed my mind. So why not just say, "I know of this with several preachers" rather than, "Black preachers"? Why even bring it up? I think that's a fair question. Why bring it up? This is a problem in our society, in the ministry, in our schools, etc., and it has NOTHING to do with race. ZILCH. Nothing! Why bring race into the picture when this is NOT a racial problem?

I cannot figure out why MOW would even need to use the word. NO ONE brought it up, until he said it was a problem with black preachers.

So, I get crucified for being factual and honest and speaking from experience instead of rumor.

Originally Posted by BeenThinkin

I did google "down-low" among whites or blacks" and got this response.

Wikipedia,
Down-low is an African-American slang term[1] which refers to a subculture of men who usually identify as heterosexual, but who have sex with men; some avoid sharing this information even if they have female sexual partner(s).[2][3][4][5] The term is also used to refer to a related sexual identity.[5][6]

There were many many more replies, all about "Black men!" ...didn't see any that referred to white men and "down-low!". Maybe I didn't look far enough.

Now should the news media and the blogs be criticied for saying, "black men?"

Maybe I should not admit this but I didn't recognize or know what the term meant!

And Renda gave us 2 or 3 news items speaking about the problem being present in black communities, including the COGIC organization.

I did not detect venom nor an ugly attitude in what MOW posted. (He simply spoke of his own, personal knowledge, and then justified that by saying he had preached for more blacks than whites and had many friends who were black.) I have felt some very harsh response back to him. Why? I don't know.

I really did not take from his post that any of his remarks were racist....just simply facts. Again the news media and other post did not seem to think there was any problem stating that it was a predominantly black issue.

Am I wrong?

Originally Posted by Mr. Smith

"He did not categorically deny that any of this happened. I hope I'm wrong (seriously) but this just seems like he is leaving way too much wiggle room. I am personally aware of this type of behavior among some black preachers. This on the "down-low" behavior has affected far more than we'll ever know."


I don't see in this statement where MOW was saying that blacks are more willing to address the issue than whites.

Of course he didn't insinuate that it ONLY happens in black churches and I don't see where anyone has stated he did. But he said he knows about this behavior among some preachers and he said they were black. He brought race into the issue. No one else did. He opened the barn door and it's hard to convince the horses to go back inside.

Again, I was being specific about what I knew first hand and you say that is a problem and smacks of racism. If you were in my community among my black friends and made that accusation you would be in a firestorm of controversy. I may be some things, but racist doesn't even come close. You make too many assumptions with too little knowledge, which is why you are off base.

Originally Posted by coadie

Wiki has some culture stuff

Who writes wikipedia?



I am the last to be up to date on slang.

Originally Posted by Berkley

Let me school you. DOWN LOW only applies to straight black men that have sex with men. In the hispanic/latino gang culture they have "homie love." Same deal, "straight" men that have sex with men. In high school the jocks are just "helping out a friend." I think most other "straight" men that have sex with men just in the "closet." Some closets with a glass door...

BINGO! This really nails it. In the circles I have "run" in, "down-low" behavior is "straight" black men, which are the only ones I know who are involved in this type of behavior, and that doesn't mean no other ethnic groups are, it's all I am familiar with, (it's just an honest and accurate statement from my experience) and as an aside life-style engage in homosexual behavior but will state that they are not homosexual.

Now anyone else can bring about any other statement they care to or parade other statistics which they care to as well. None of that changes my knowledge and experience or the accuracy of my statements. And honestly, I can take all the attacks anyone wants to dish out.

This is ONLY an internet forum and I really do have a life outside of this. I neither need this place for significance, affirmation or simply to feel good. I just enjoy it from time to time and throw my two cents in. You don't have to agree with it or even like it. But it is MY two cents and you have a right to yours as well.

[Mr. Smith]

Originally Posted by ManOfWord

So, I get crucified for being factual and honest and speaking from experience instead of rumor.





Again, I was being specific about what I knew first hand and you say that is a problem and smacks of racism. If you were in my community among my black friends and made that accusation you would be in a firestorm of controversy. I may be some things, but racist doesn't even come close. You make too many assumptions with too little knowledge, which is why you are off base.





BINGO! This really nails it. In the circles I have "run" in, "down-low" behavior is "straight" black men, which are the only ones I know who are involved in this type of behavior, and that doesn't mean no other ethnic groups are, it's all I am familiar with, (it's just an honest and accurate statement from my experience) and as an aside life-style engage in homosexual behavior but will state that they are not homosexual.

Now anyone else can bring about any other statement they care to or parade other statistics which they care to as well. None of that changes my knowledge and experience or the accuracy of my statements. And honestly, I can take all the attacks anyone wants to dish out.

This is ONLY an internet forum and I really do have a life outside of this. I neither need this place for significance, affirmation or simply to feel good. I just enjoy it from time to time and throw my two cents in. You don't have to agree with it or even like it. But it is MY two cents and you have a right to yours as well.

No one's crucifying you, Mr. Martyr Complex. I called you out because you turned this thread into a racial issue rather than what was being discussed. Your experience does NOT equivocate societal trends. You didn't say, "This is a big problem with preachers", you said, "I am personally aware of this type of behavior among some BLACK preachers." WHY DIDN'T YOU JUST SAY "PREACHERS"?? Why did it need to be "Black preachers"???

Also DO NOT claim that I said your statements "Smack of racism". I didn't say that or anything close. I said you're either ignorant of the facts of national statistical trends of child molestation, OR you're bigoted. I think you're ignoring the facts. I don't want to believe you're bigoted.

I really don't care about your black friends. If you said what you said in MY community (about black preachers), you'd get laughed out of town.

You insinuated that this type of behavior is more problematic in the black ministerial culture than other ministerial cultures and I find that sickening.

[Mr. Smith]

Originally Posted by ManOfWord

So, I get crucified for being factual and honest and speaking from experience instead of rumor.





Again, I was being specific about what I knew first hand and you say that is a problem and smacks of racism. If you were in my community among my black friends and made that accusation you would be in a firestorm of controversy. I may be some things, but racist doesn't even come close. You make too many assumptions with too little knowledge, which is why you are off base.

AND, Mr. Martyr, I'm not the only one objecting to your absurd statement. There are, at least, three others who had a problem with it. Answer their posts. Focus your attention on someone besides me.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by ManOfWord

BINGO! This really nails it. In the circles I have "run" in, "down-low" behavior is "straight" black men, which are the only ones I know who are involved in this type of behavior, and that doesn't mean no other ethnic groups are, it's all I am familiar with, (it's just an honest and accurate statement from my experience) and as an aside life-style engage in homosexual behavior but will state that they are not homosexual.

This is just the strangest thing. The Muslims say they are also against homosexuality and as long as they don't "love" the guy they are doing, they don't consider it homosexuality.

I read the article in the Times that someone posted in a previous post. They are passing along AIDS, but won't use protection because if they used protection they would have to focus on the fact that it is a homosexual act. Strange thinking. Strange to call themselves "straight" when they are practicing homosexual acts. Bisexual people are not straight.

The world is absolutely nuts and getting nuttier!