No More Sacrifice For Sin

[A.W. Bowman]

This is great! Truly. A discussion of a subject that is all but ignored by 'the Ministry'.
Thank you.

[Digging4Truth]

Originally Posted by HaShaliach

This is great! Truly. A discussion of a subject that is all but ignored by 'the Ministry'.
Thank you.

Thanks Brother. I would be honored to have your input on this subject.

[Sweet Pea]

Originally Posted by Digging4Truth

What are your thoughts on this verse?

Hbr 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

I have been taught that "context, context, context" is important.

I was taught that Paul was speaking to the Jews in the church. Some of them didn't want to give up certain portions of the law and wanted to continue offering sacrifices.

He was saying..... There is no more sacrifice for those who have received Jesus as their Saviour. HE was the ultimate sacrifice. Sacrificing for the atonement of sins was finished at Calvary.

[missourimary]

Or... if a person turns to Christ and then turns back to Jewish tradition, there is no sacrifice because they've denied the greatest and true sacrifice. This wouldn't prevent someone returning to God, but would show Jews why they shouldn't turn from Christ once they'd converted. Under the old covenant:

Heb 10:1The law is only a shadow of the good things that are coming—not the realities themselves. For this reason it can never, by the same sacrifices repeated endlessly year after year, make perfect those who draw near to worship. 2If it could, would they not have stopped being offered? For the worshipers would have been cleansed once for all, and would no longer have felt guilty for their sins. 3But those sacrifices are an annual reminder of sins, 4because it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins.

The new covenant offered a better way.

8First he said, “Sacrifices and offerings, burnt offerings and sin offerings you did not desire, nor were you pleased with them” (although the law required them to be made). 9Then he said, “Here I am, I have come to do your will.” He sets aside the first to establish the second. 10And by that will, we have been made holy through the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

11Day after day every priest stands and performs his religious duties; again and again he offers the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. 12But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God. 13Since that time he waits for his enemies to be made his footstool, 14because by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy.

Heb 10:26 isn't saying that a person can't come back to God once they've sinned. It's saying that outside of Christ there is no sacrifice, only judgment. So the Jews who turn back to the law and traditions can't really go back--there's nothing to go back to. The old covenant sacrifice has been done away with by the new covenant.

[Digging4Truth]

Originally Posted by missourimary

Or... if a person turns to Christ and then turns back to Jewish tradition, there is no sacrifice because they've denied the greatest and true sacrifice. This wouldn't prevent someone returning to God, but would show Jews why they shouldn't turn from Christ once they'd converted. Under the old covenant:

The new covenant offered a better way.

Heb 10:26 isn't saying that a person can't come back to God once they've sinned. It's saying that outside of Christ there is no sacrifice, only judgment. So the Jews who turn back to the law and traditions can't really go back--there's nothing to go back to. The old covenant sacrifice has been done away with by the new covenant.

Yes ma'am. This is where it looks like it is heading to me too. I read chapter 10 and went back to chapter 9 for more context on the discussion and I am now back to chapter 8... it's a little slow because I'm listening to the chapters online while I work and I keep getting distracted and have to listen again... and again... and again.

[Arphaxad]

Originally Posted by Digging4Truth

What are your thoughts on this verse?

Hbr 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

I believe that "sin willfully" means "living a lifestyle of sin, like we were before salvation". Than as time goes by a strong delusion will come that convinces us that we are actually still o.k. with God in that state( reprobate mindset), and will feel no need to repent (no more sacrifice for sins).

[NotforSale]

I find this subject is full of speculation and assumption, leaving common sense thinkers by the wayside. In other words, people become the target of absurd judgment and name calling, and those who step in to put out these false fires are deemed as liberal, rebellious, or evil.

For instance, take a look at the Prodigal Son. This young man takes his fathers inheritance, completely wastes every penny on riotous living, and finds himself at the bottom of the bottom. The Church today would chastise this boy as a fool and a backslider. I have seen this done more times than I can count and the Church is guilty of labeling people before the end result.

Speculation has become Religions greatest flaw; we presume to know, when we don't.

I think we need to stop putting people in Heaven, or Hell, calling them saved, and unsaved, getting back to the basics that Humans will FAIL. Failure will always be our demise and the Church must accept this fact of life. Regardless of what anyone says, there is no utopia!! There is no Nirvana! We are incapable of becoming good enough, and chasing this false dream will destroy more lives than it saves.

I have come to the conclusion, the Church must return to embracing the failed, the dirty, the confused, the sick, and people who never attain our level of understanding. If we don't, we ourselves will be condemned because we leave people in the gutter after they've been ravaged by thieves of circumstance or bad choices. Churches have become “Clubs” and when members don’t measure up to the status symbol of that Group (Race, dress, beliefs, ect), out comes the Axe.

This is beyond sad.

[A.W. Bowman]

A point:

Originally Posted by Sweet Pea

I was taught that Paul was speaking to the Jews in the church. Some of them didn't want to give up certain portions of the law and wanted to continue offering sacrifices.

He was saying..... There is no more sacrifice for those who have received Jesus as their Saviour. HE was the ultimate sacrifice. Sacrificing for the atonement of sins was finished at Calvary.

This is indeed very close to the mark. However, the operative words, as already noted by others, in this verse are, “For if we sin willfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, …” Hebrews 10:26.

The context of verse 26 is found in verses 22-31, concerning individuals who willfully continue in their sin – there is no other sacrifice for that additional sin, other than the blood sacrifice of Jesus Christ. Yet, even that atonement has its limits, as already noted on this thread and concluded in Heb 22:28-31.

--------------------------
Heb 10:22-31 Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water. Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised; )

And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works: Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching. For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?

For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people. It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

---------------------------------

While it is also true that once the Ark of the Covenant was lost and the Temple destroyed, it was not even possible to perform another 'biblical' sacrifice for sin, according to the Law.

This fact also impacts many doctrines of today (far reaching implications) which still rely on observing some parts of the Law - while dismissing other portions. But, that is another subject for another day.

Added note:

Heb 6:4-6 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

[Digging4Truth]

Originally Posted by NotforSale

I find this subject is full of speculation and assumption, leaving common sense thinkers by the wayside. In other words, people become the target of absurd judgment and name calling, and those who step in to put out these false fires are deemed as liberal, rebellious, or evil.

For instance, take a look at the Prodigal Son. This young man takes his fathers inheritance, completely wastes every penny on riotous living, and finds himself at the bottom of the bottom. The Church today would chastise this boy as a fool and a backslider. I have seen this done more times than I can count and the Church is guilty of labeling people before the end result.

Speculation has become Religions greatest flaw; we presume to know, when we don't.

I think we need to stop putting people in Heaven, or Hell, calling them saved, and unsaved, getting back to the basics that Humans will FAIL. Failure will always be our demise and the Church must accept this fact of life. Regardless of what anyone says, there is no utopia!! There is no Nirvana! We are incapable of becoming good enough, and chasing this false dream will destroy more than lives than it saves.

I have come to the conclusion, the Church must return to embracing the failed, the dirty, the confused, the sick, and people who never attain our level of understanding. If we don't, we ourselves will be condemned because we leave people in the gutter after they've been ravaged by thieves of circumstance or bad choices. Churches have become “Clubs” and when members don’t measure up to the status symbol of that Group (Race, dress, beliefs, ect), out comes the Axe.

This is beyond sad.

Uhhh... NFS... have you read the posts in this thread? Have you observed the directions we are headed with this?

What an odd post considering the discussion that has gone on in this thread.

[NotforSale]

Originally Posted by Digging4Truth

Uhhh... NFS... have you read the posts in this thread? Have you observed the directions we are headed with this?

What an odd post considering the discussion that has gone on in this thread.

Here is Jason's post:

I think it speaks of one who refuses to accept the chastening of the Lord, who,though warned and punished, continuies in disobedience, rebellion, unbelief, and unrepentance turned over to a rebrobate mind.

I don't think people can backslide and get saved again. I think we would classify someone as backslid, when many times they are being disobedient and subjecting themselves to the chaseting of God (such as David w/ Basheeba). BUT if one truly backslides and does get to the point spoken of in Hebrews 10:26, I think that is where the warning in Hebrews 6 comes in so strongly "it is impossible to rnew them to repentance..."

Basically in my view, I don't believe your once saved, always saved, nor do I believe salvation is so fickle that you (can possibly) posess it and lose it multiple times in a lifetime. I think once you have been saved, it is difficult to be lost, but still possible. But IF someone did lose their salvation, it would be impossible to "get saved again". I think the Bible backs up my point, though I admit this hasn't been one of the topics I've spent much time on.

This post is chock full of speculation. When the topic of who’s in, and who’s out comes up, you always see the subject of mercy go this direction.

D4T, there are things we just don't know, and where God draws the line is God's business, not ours.