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  #221  
Old 02-02-2011, 08:43 PM
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OneAccord OneAccord is offline
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Re: Prodigal Son Distorted by FB Pastor

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Originally Posted by BeenThinkin View Post
WOW! You bring tears to my eyes! Would like to share a poem with you. You may already have it. If not, I hope it ministers to you. It's called "The Dash!"

The Dash

by Linda Ellis
I read of a preacher who stood to speak
At the funeral of his friend;
He referred to the dates on her tombstone
From the beginning — to the end.

He noted that first came the date of her birth,
And he spoke of the following date with tears;
But he said what mattered most of all
Was the dash between the years.

For that dash represents all the time
That she spent alive on earth,
And now only those who loved him
Know what that little line is worth.

For it matters not how much we own,
The cars, the house, the cash;
What matters is how we live and love
And how we spend our dash.

So think about this long and hard,
Are there things you’d like to change?
For you never know how much time is left...
You could be at “dash-mid-range!”

If we could just slow down enough
To consider what’s true and real;
And always try to understand
The way other people feel.

And be less quick to anger,
And show appreciation more;
And love the people in our lives
Like we’ve never loved before.

If we treat each other with respect
And more often wear a smile,
Remembering that this special dash
Might only last a little while.

So, when your Eulogy is being read,
With your life’s actions to rehash...
Would you be pleased with the things they say
About how you spent your dash?

Been Thinkin
Absolutely beautiful. And so true. Thanks BT, now I have tears in my eyes.
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  #222  
Old 02-02-2011, 08:47 PM
Maximilian Maximilian is offline
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Re: Prodigal Son Distorted by FB Pastor

In biblical interpretation a dichotomy is presented between literal meaning and spiritual meaning. Sometimes the reader is exhorted to search for the literal meaning and not the spiritua. We are uncomfortable in this dichotomy; indeed, we think that the term literal does more to confuse than to clarify. Many people use the term literal interpretation to stress that they believe the actual historical details of the Bible, especially the miracles. While certainly affirming the historicity of the BIble and miracles, but many thnk that the literal is too fuzzy. The Bible is full of figures of speech ad symbolic language. The determination of meaning has to take this into account. Such figures and symbols reflect a very nonliteral usage of language. For this reason, many exegetes use the term "literary meaning" -- that is the meaning that the authors have placed in the text. It reflects the type of literature used, the context, the historical background, the grammar, word meanings -- basically everything involved in hermeneutics. This literary meaning does not preempt or replace the spiritual meaning. Because the Bible is basically about God and his relationship with us, this literary meaning will be a spiritual meaning as well.

So the real dichotomy is not literal and spiritual, but between the meaning the authors intended and the meaning a reader drums up and projects into the text.
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  #223  
Old 02-02-2011, 09:05 PM
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Re: Prodigal Son Distorted by FB Pastor

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Originally Posted by Maximilian View Post
In biblical interpretation a dichotomy is presented between literal meaning and spiritual meaning. Sometimes the reader is exhorted to search for the literal meaning and not the spiritua. We are uncomfortable in this dichotomy; indeed, we think that the term literal does more to confuse than to clarify. Many people use the term literal interpretation to stress that they believe the actual historical details of the Bible, especially the miracles. While certainly affirming the historicity of the BIble and miracles, but many thnk that the literal is too fuzzy. The Bible is full of figures of speech ad symbolic language. The determination of meaning has to take this into account. Such figures and symbols reflect a very nonliteral usage of language. For this reason, many exegetes use the term "literary meaning" -- that is the meaning that the authors have placed in the text. It reflects the type of literature used, the context, the historical background, the grammar, word meanings -- basically everything involved in hermeneutics. This literary meaning does not preempt or replace the spiritual meaning. Because the Bible is basically about God and his relationship with us, this literary meaning will be a spiritual meaning as well.

So the real dichotomy is not literal and spiritual, but between the meaning the authors intended and the meaning a reader drums up and projects into the text.
Songwriters often write songs with a certain meaning in mind. However, they write the song in such a way that allows other meanings to take shape. Is it always wrong to say a song means something other than what the author originally intended? If its okay for songs to do that then could the bible sometimes be written in a similiar way?
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  #224  
Old 02-02-2011, 09:06 PM
RandyWayne RandyWayne is offline
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Re: Prodigal Son Distorted by FB Pastor

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Originally Posted by jfrog View Post
Songwriters often write songs with a certain meaning in mind. However, they write the song in such a way that allows other meanings to take shape. Is it wrong to say a song means something other than what the author originally intended? If not then could the bible sometimes be written in a similiar way?
Sort of like "I Am the Walrus" by the Beatles?
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  #225  
Old 02-02-2011, 09:08 PM
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pelathais pelathais is offline
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Re: Prodigal Son Distorted by FB Pastor

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Originally Posted by Maximilian View Post
In biblical interpretation a dichotomy is presented between literal meaning and spiritual meaning. Sometimes the reader is exhorted to search for the literal meaning and not the spiritua. We are uncomfortable in this dichotomy; indeed, we think that the term literal does more to confuse than to clarify. Many people use the term literal interpretation to stress that they believe the actual historical details of the Bible, especially the miracles. While certainly affirming the historicity of the BIble and miracles, but many thnk that the literal is too fuzzy. The Bible is full of figures of speech ad symbolic language. The determination of meaning has to take this into account. Such figures and symbols reflect a very nonliteral usage of language. For this reason, many exegetes use the term "literary meaning" -- that is the meaning that the authors have placed in the text. It reflects the type of literature used, the context, the historical background, the grammar, word meanings -- basically everything involved in hermeneutics. This literary meaning does not preempt or replace the spiritual meaning. Because the Bible is basically about God and his relationship with us, this literary meaning will be a spiritual meaning as well.

So the real dichotomy is not literal and spiritual, but between the meaning the authors intended and the meaning a reader drums up and projects into the text.
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  #226  
Old 02-02-2011, 09:09 PM
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Re: Prodigal Son Distorted by FB Pastor

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Originally Posted by RandyWayne View Post
Sort of like "I Am the Walrus" by the Beatles?
Actually I think that song is the perfect example of what Maximillian was talking about. That song was written to be meaningless and then because people assumed it must have some deeper meaning they would project a meaning into it.
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Last edited by jfrog; 02-02-2011 at 09:15 PM.
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  #227  
Old 02-02-2011, 09:10 PM
RandyWayne RandyWayne is offline
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Re: Prodigal Son Distorted by FB Pastor

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Originally Posted by jfrog View Post
Actually I think that song is the perfect example of what Maximillian was talking about. That song was written to be meaningless and then because people assumed it must have some deeper meaning they would project a meaning into it.
I know the story behind it is that John Lennon got sick of people reading way way way too much into their songs.
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  #228  
Old 02-02-2011, 09:15 PM
Maximilian Maximilian is offline
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Re: Prodigal Son Distorted by FB Pastor

Allegories

Battles between spiritual and literal go bak to the first few centuries after Christ. Numerous early Christian scholars felt that the OT would only be relevant if it spoke directly of Christ. To those developed a system of interpretation that acknowledged a "literal" meaning of the text, but then encouraged the interpreter to look for the deeper, fuller, spiritual meaning below the surface of the text. Some settled for a two-level system (literal and spiritual), some multi-leveled into three (corresponding to body, soul, spirit), some four (literal, allegorical, moral and anagogical).

For example, the fourfold system would see four levels of meaning for the city of Jerusalem: 1) Literal: the actual Israelite city, 2) allegorical: the Church of Christ, 3)moral: the soul of a person and 4) anagogical: the heavenly city of God. By the 4th Century this interpretative approach was popular among the many writers of the church, and allegorical interpretation, as this approach is now known, became the normal way of approaching the OT. It remained popular until the Reformation, when Calvin/Luther (primarily) led the the Church away form the allegorical approach.

The Reformers still occasionally used allegorical interpretation, in general though they returned the church to the literary context of the Bible for the determination of meaning. Contemporary Evangelical scholarship has since followed in the Reformed's steps, and has cautioned the Church against using fanciful allegorical interpretations that are often based more on imagination than on the text itself. However, allegorical was still used by some popular preachers in the 20th Century, and is still around in various forms, and more predominately in some groups.
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  #229  
Old 02-02-2011, 09:16 PM
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Re: Prodigal Son Distorted by FB Pastor

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Originally Posted by RandyWayne View Post
I know the story behind it is that John Lennon got sick of people reading way way way too much into their songs.
Do you think it means something?
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  #230  
Old 02-02-2011, 09:16 PM
RandyWayne RandyWayne is offline
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Re: Prodigal Son Distorted by FB Pastor

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Do you think it means something?
Nothing at all. Notta.
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