Standards!

hometown guy · #1 03-27-2011, 02:18 PM

matthew23:26Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.

I know we have get are hearts right with God before we can worry about our ouside appearance but I am thankful for the standards that are taught to keep are inside clean..................
I have heard so many people say standards are bondage, legalism, ect…but I thank God for men of God that will stand up and take a stand on certain things for the safety of Gods people.
I don’t let my kids do a lot of things that are not “wrong” but I can see down the road to where it may lead so I don’t let them do it.
I am so thankful that there is still men of God that will take a stand for thing despite knowing that they are going to be accused of wanting to control and being a legalist and so on …. But from my experience they are just men that want a safe place for people in this dirty world.

Hoovie · #2 03-27-2011, 02:37 PM

I pretty much agree. Personal conservative and even UC standards placed in our lives for protection and preservation are fine, IF it is done without anger, wrath, and condemnation of those who reached different conclusions.

RandyWayne · #3 03-27-2011, 03:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hometown guy

matthew23:26Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.

I know we have get are hearts right with God before we can worry about our ouside appearance but I am thankful for the standards that are taught to keep are inside clean..................
I have heard so many people say standards are bondage, legalism, ect…but I thank God for men of God that will stand up and take a stand on certain things for the safety of Gods people.
I don’t let my kids do a lot of things that are not “wrong” but I can see down the road to where it may lead so I don’t let them do it.
I am so thankful that there is still men of God that will take a stand for thing despite knowing that they are going to be accused of wanting to control and being a legalist and so on …. But from my experience they are just men that want a safe place for people in this dirty world.

What you said in the bold is very poignant to this post. You are responsible for your children both as someone living under your roof and as minors. The question is, does your pastor have the same authority over your kids that you do? Does he have the same authority over you that you have over them? This is what separates a UC church from those that are not. It isn't the degree or strictness of the standards but rather the authority given to the "man of god" to enforce them and how far you let him into your home.

Arphaxad · #4 03-27-2011, 04:02 PM

I am not anti-standards, but how do they keep our "insides" clean? Isn't that relying on our own works instead of relying on Jesus?

smurfette · #5 03-27-2011, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hoovie

I pretty much agree. Personal conservative and even UC standards placed in our lives for protection and preservation are fine, IF it is done without anger, wrath, and condemnation of those who reached different conclusions.

That's the big 'IF"

Hoovie · #6 03-27-2011, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smurfette

[/B]

That's the big 'IF"

It is. But that is pretty much how I approach it.

BeenThinkin · #7 03-27-2011, 04:37 PM

What are we really doing to our kids when we teach them and hold them accountable for things that are "not wrong" but are standards that some man has established as "his" standards?

Things are different than they were 30 to 40 years ago. In earlier days, in many cases, no one was allowed to question anything they heard from the pulpit. They made their children line up to whatever came across the pulpit.

Then as those children grew up in the 70's and 80's they left the strict standards and found their own way in the world and in religion. And I'm not just talking about the lowly members, I'm talking about the children of top leadership. And there are numerous examples of what I am talking about.

So, when we force rules on our kids that are non-biblical we may be forcing them from the church when they get to the point of thinking for themselves. Another preacher comes along, another set of rules and "standards" is demanded and how confusing to the the children.

Leadership needs to lead and not drive, and simply preach what thus saith the Word of God and leave the rest of the man made rules alone. Call them what you will, but un-biblical "standards" end up doing more damage in many cases than they do good.

Just my thoughts.....

Been Thinkin

CC1 · #8 03-27-2011, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hoovie

I pretty much agree. Personal conservative and even UC standards placed in our lives for protection and preservation are fine, IF it is done without anger, wrath, and condemnation of those who reached different conclusions.

So exactly how often do you see persons with conservative / ultra conservtive standards in the UPC not have condemnation for those who reach a different conclusion? Personally I have not found it much. The occasional rare exception and that is it.

My experience is the more conservative people are the more they tend to judge others salvation by standards.

Hoovie · #9 03-27-2011, 04:46 PM

I think the key is keeping things in proper perspective. It has been demonstrated repeatedly that even the more liberal among us have so required standards of conduct and even dress standards they would like the church to follow. There should be understanding as to what is clearly "sin" and what is becoming conduct for the church (in their opinion).

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeenThinkin

What are we really doing to our kids when we teach them and hold them accountable for things that are "not wrong" but are standards that some man has established as "his" standards?

Things are different than they were 30 to 40 years ago. In earlier days, in many cases, no one was allowed to question anything they heard from the pulpit. They made their children line up to whatever came across the pulpit.

Then as those children grew up in the 70's and 80's they left the strict standards and found their own way in the world and in religion. And I'm not just talking about the lowly members, I'm talking about the children of top leadership. And there are numerous examples of what I am talking about.

So, when we force rules on our kids that are non-biblical we may be forcing them from the church when they get to the point of thinking for themselves. Another preacher comes along, another set of rules and "standards" is demanded and how confusing to the the children.

Leadership needs to lead and not drive, and simply preach what thus saith the Word of God and leave the rest of the man made rules alone. Call them what you will, but un-biblical "standards" end up doing more damage in many cases than they do good.

Just my thoughts.....

Been Thinkin

Hoovie · #10 03-27-2011, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CC1

So exactly how often do you see persons with conservative / ultra conservtive standards in the UPC not have condemnation for those who reach a different conclusion? Personally I have not found it much. The occasional rare exception and that is it.

My experience is the more conservative people are the more they tend to judge others salvation by standards.

I would use myself and my entire Mennonite family as example.

We were never heavy on the judgement of other Christians even while being ultra cons ourselves.