What Must I Do?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Nope. Jesus said,

John 6:39
And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

Jesus will loose NONE of those whom the Father has given Him. Else Jesus didn't accomplish God's will. Also Jesus draws distinction between those drawn and given to Him by the Father...

Jesus did not say all whom the Father has DRAWN will not be lost. He said ALL WHO WERE GIVEN. Many are called but few are chosen. The chosen were the ones finally given. But the drawing is the same thing as the calling.

John 17:9
I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.

Who belong to God? Only those drawn by the Father and given to Christ.

No. Only those GIVEN to Him. Not drawn.

Also note what Jesus says...

John 12:32
And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

This verse doesn't say that God "draws all men". This verse says that God will "draw all men"... unto Christ. Since we know that all men do not come to Christ, we must conclude that all those who are drawn, are those who belong to the Father in accordance to His divine will... not the entire world.

No, that is simply saying Christ died in the stead of every single person. That does not mean each one is saved, though.

Man get away from that silly Calvinism. It's crazy, bro. You are better than that. First UR, now Calvinism. What next?

[Aquila]

The Order of Salvation:

1. Election (God's choice of people to be saved)
2. Atonement (Christ's work of satisfying the law for the Elect)
3. Propitiation (Christ's satisfying God's wrath and anger against the sins of the Elect - past, present, future)
4. The Gospel call (the proclamation of the gospel)
5. Regeneration (holy conviction)
6. Conversion (faith and repentance)
7. Justification (right legal standing)
8. Adoption (membership in God's family)
9. Sanctification (right conduct in life)
10. Perseverance (remaining a Christian)
11. Death (going to be with the Lord)
12. Glorification (receiving a resurrection body in sinless perfection)

[Digging4Truth]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Jesus did not say all whom the Father has DRAWN will not be lost. He said ALL WHO WERE GIVEN. Many are called but few are chosen. The chosen were the ones finally given. But the drawing is the same thing as the calling.



No. Only those GIVEN to Him. Not drawn.



No, that is simply saying Christ died in the stead of every single person. That does not mean each one is saved, though.

Man get away from that silly Calvinism. It's crazy, bro. You are better than that. First UR, now Calvinism. What next?

Indeed. The scripture that comes to mind is many are called but few are chosen.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Aquila

The Order of Salvation:

1. Election (God's choice of people to be saved)
2. Atonement (Christ's work of satisfying the law for the Elect)
3. Propitiation (Christ's satisfying God's wrath and anger against the sins of the Elect - past, present, future)
4. The Gospel call (the proclamation of the gospel)
5. Regeneration (holy conviction)
6. Conversion (faith and repentance)
7. Justification (right legal standing)
8. Adoption (membership in God's family)
9. Sanctification (right conduct in life)
10. Perseverance (remaining a Christian)
11. Death (going to be with the Lord)
12. Glorification (receiving a resurrection body in sinless perfection)

REGENERATON IS NOT HOLY CONVICTION. WOW. It is resurrection with Christ.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Now, you know very well that being dead in sins is a far cry from being physically dead where we do not have a mind to think with.

I presented scriptures that disprove your theory that we are awakened from spiritual death before we even know the Gospel.

This is where your disconnect might be. I never said that one is awakened from spiritual death BEFORE we even know the Gospel. I said one is awakened from spiritual death BEFORE one can put faith in the Gospel they have heard. The preached Gospel is the vehicle through which the Holy Spirit awakens the spiritually dead.

- A spiritually dead man hears the Gospel preached under the anointing in God’s perfect placement and timing.

- That spiritually dead man is then regenerated, awakened by the Holy Spirit through the preached Word.

- Awakened, he is convicted by sin and begins to realize his need for a Saviour.

- He then chooses to believe the Gospel, repents of sin, is baptized, and filled with the Holy Ghost (conversion).

I never said one is regenerated before hearing the Gospel. I said they are regenerated before placing faith in the Gospel that has awakened them.

Now… you believe that God has drawn, and will draw, all men to Christ (though many will reject Him). Untold numbers of individuals are perishing without having so much as having heard the Gospel this very night. How is the Father drawing them to Christ without them having heard the Gospel??? Now you have the Father drawing men by something other than the Spirit through the power of the cross.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by mfblume

REGENERATON IS NOT HOLY CONVICTION. WOW. It is resurrection with Christ.

Conviction is the result of regeneration. The spiritually dead don't feel conviction over sin.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Digging4Truth

Indeed. The scripture that comes to mind is many are called but few are chosen.

Unless we're talking about Episcopalians; of which it can be said.... Many are cold but few are frozen.

[Jack Shephard]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Conviction is the result of regeneration. The spiritually dead don't feel conviction over sin.

Amen.....

[NorCal]

One verse kills the Calvinism Theology.
Acts 10:34 - So Peter opened his mouth and said: “Truly I understand that God shows no partiality,"

If GOD did not provide a way for ALL to be saved, then he has shown partiality to those who are saved. Calvinism is a heresy.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by NorCal

One verse kills the Calvinism Theology.
Acts 10:34 - So Peter opened his mouth and said: “Truly I understand that God shows no partiality,"

If GOD did not provide a way for ALL to be saved, then he has shown partiality to those who are saved. Calvinism is a heresy.

No... God has shown mercy to the undeserving who would have otherwise perished. Peter's point however, is that God shows no partiality between Jew and Gentile. You will find all peoples among God's elect.

You're under the illusion that all deserve a chance. The truth is... NONE of us deserve a chance. All we deserve is Hell.

If God has chosen you... fall on your face weeping with thankfulness and reverence. You had nothing to do with it. Your God rescued you from a devil's Hell.