Check this Book Out!!

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by bbyrd009

Ah, ok, this is "Universalism?" I have a little experience with it, but I don't remember Christ being removed from their equation, hmm.

Christian Universalism as presented by many teaches that there will be a purification process of the wicked dead. Something akin the the "Purgetory" doctrine of the Catholics. During that process the person will repent and then be saved.

Others simply teach since God loves everyone they shall simply enter Heaven but with less rewards. There are probably other versions also. Christian Universalism does not leave Christ out of the picture just invents him according to their own belief.

[bbyrd009]

Ok, well I gotta tell ya, i didn't get any of that from Matt Fox, and this book seems to mostly be interested in highlighting the same thing? Don't know, haven't read it, but it seems the same gist as my "death centric western Christian" rant. I hope you see that there might be a diff in your doctrinal theses above, which ya, I'm not buying, and this. Possibly.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by bbyrd009

Ok, well I gotta tell ya, i didn't get any of that from Matt Fox, and this book seems to mostly be interested in highlighting the same thing? Don't know, haven't read it, but it seems the same gist as my "death centric western Christian" rant. I hope you see that there might be a diff in your doctrinal theses above, which ya, I'm not buying, and this. Possibly.

My thoughts were addressing a review of the book in question. The reviewer had really enjoyed it.

Are you a Christian Universalist?

[bbyrd009]

Ha, I'm not into modalism, or I'd be embarrassed that I had to Google that! Lol. No, I am not a universalist, at least according to wikipedia. But I have gone to their services before (a long time ago) and one would think that a doctrine like this would produce degenerates--I'm kind of missing their whole point, actually.

ps and the uni church I attended didn't seem degenerate; i remem them being pretty vibrant.

[Jay]

Some people do not want to accept truth, and when they are faced with it wish to claim abuse. I have yet to have felt any abuse by the preaching of Hell. I would be interested in reading his book, however I am certain as to what I will find.

[crakjak]

If you don't believe people have been abused by the preaching of endless torment in literal fire, you are not living in the real world.

This book is written by a hospice provider that has dealt with numerous people that are facing death with deathly fear of face a uncertain future because they have been taught the if they miss the perfect concept of truth, they are going to suffer literal fire on the bodies endlessly!!!

This author has studied for years and presents the evidence of the religious conspiracy of eternal punishment, clearly refutes ED. Both from scripture and history.

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by Amanah

If i can find it at the library, I will reserve it and read it. checking now.

It is available for $5 from Amazon, on in the Kindle version.

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by Jay

Some people do not want to accept truth, and when they are faced with it wish to claim abuse. I have yet to have felt any abuse by the preaching of Hell. I would be interested in reading his book, however I am certain as to what I will find.

Jay, I understand that the old style hellfire and brimstone preaching is fading away, but the doctrine is still alive and well in many religious persuasions.

I was as a very young child very afraid of God, and of hell. You tell me if it is abuse to emotionally scream at young child about the likelihood of them going to hell?? That if you don't live perfectly, if you die with one unconfessed sin you are going there. Fortunately, my father did not focus on this approach, but the youth camps and campmeetings we attended had lots of it.

Further there are millions and millions of Catholics that live in mortal fear of literal fire in hell forever. Less than ten years ago, the church that we attended, and it was a nondenm. spiritfilled believing church, taught the fire and brimstone approach. This was a fairly mainstream church.

So, do yourself a favor and read the book, it glorifies God, the Cross and true Christianity.

[bbyrd009]

Well, I will be interested to read it, as I have hung on to ED, albeit in a more BeHereNow type of setting. I was not easily brought around to Fox's dismissal of our "born a sinner" theology, but it was obvious, in hindsight anyway. I have never quite gotten over the parallels to ED, and wonder if it might just be another "empire builder" way to manipulate the masses.

Hopefully he's heavy on the Scripture part.
http://www.wikihow.com/index.php?tit...&oldid=7193158
for a synopsis of M Fox, "Original Creation," which illuminates the creation of the fall/redemption, born a sinner mythology.

[Jay]

Originally Posted by crakjak

Jay, I understand that the old style hellfire and brimstone preaching is fading away, but the doctrine is still alive and well in many religious persuasions.

I was as a very young child very afraid of God, and of hell. You tell me if it is abuse to emotionally scream at young child about the likelihood of them going to hell?? That if you don't live perfectly, if you die with one unconfessed sin you are going there. Fortunately, my father did not focus on this approach, but the youth camps and campmeetings we attended had lots of it.

Further there are millions and millions of Catholics that live in mortal fear of literal fire in hell forever. Less than ten years ago, the church that we attended, and it was a nondenm. spiritfilled believing church, taught the fire and brimstone approach. This was a fairly mainstream church.

So, do yourself a favor and read the book, it glorifies God, the Cross and true Christianity.

I have sat many times under the preaching of Hell fire. I have never once felt abused by that fact. I have afterward searched my heart because I desire to be perfect in the eyes of God. I am fully aware of how far I must go to attain that position, but I will not cease. I love my God and do not wish to fail Him, however, I also bear in mind the recompense that is due when I contemplate rebellion against His authority. My aversion to pain and suffering is enough to make me want to get as close to Jesus as possible.

The problem with Catholicism is that they take away from the doctrine of Hell by adding other doctrines to comfort their souls such as purgatory and limbo. Further, they will actually put more people into purgatory than they will ever say went to Hell.

I believe that Hell is a place of eternal pain, suffering, and explicit photographic memory. I believe that the cravings that caused a person to rebel against the Lord during life will remain and torment them after death. I do not believe that there is any release for those that are eternally lost for it is not located in Scripture.