A Wrecked Church! - Page 10

rgcraig · #1 07-10-2012, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

Some thoughts(since I am a pastor and have known the pastor this is some observations maybe not thought of)
1. The former pastor was a demanded preacher and singer for which he recieved I would say a sizable income from his preaching out also he was an organizational official for year that probably(?) netted some income. Like mpst preachers of that era he probably dumped it all right back into the church. Pastor who teach the tithes belongs to the ministry(I believe that also) the majority pay most of the church bills and improvements and guest preachers out of the tithe. Years ago the tax professionals were telling us do NOT have two accounts. That has changed but I can see how a man 20 years or more to my senior might not comprehend the changes in the tax laws? Thus this unfortunate ordeal.
2. I wonder if the members thought of asking those prominent men who fellowshipped the church and pastor about coming in and trying to reconcile this situation? I know some of the men that were close to the pastor and church maybe their influence could help?
3. Some church in the area is getting ready to have revival.
4. I feel so sad for the saints who have been faithful.
5. I do NOT believe the church should be set up like a family business where the family decides who is going to be the pastor.

Bro. E,

I appreciate you taking the time to respond. I agree with your post!!

MissBrattified · #2 07-10-2012, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

Some thoughts(since I am a pastor and have known the pastor this is some observations maybe not thought of)
1. The former pastor was a demanded preacher and singer for which he recieved I would say a sizable income from his preaching out also he was an organizational official for year that probably(?) netted some income. Like mpst preachers of that era he probably dumped it all right back into the church. Pastor who teach the tithes belongs to the ministry(I believe that also) the majority pay most of the church bills and improvements and guest preachers out of the tithe. Years ago the tax professionals were telling us do NOT have two accounts. That has changed but I can see how a man 20 years or more to my senior might not comprehend the changes in the tax laws? Thus this unfortunate ordeal.
2. I wonder if the members thought of asking those prominent men who fellowshipped the church and pastor about coming in and trying to reconcile this situation? I know some of the men that were close to the pastor and church maybe their influence could help?
3. Some church in the area is getting ready to have revival.
4. I feel so sad for the saints who have been faithful.
5. I do NOT believe the church should be set up like a family business where the family decides who is going to be the pastor.

ILG · #3 07-11-2012, 08:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

Some thoughts(since I am a pastor and have known the pastor this is some observations maybe not thought of)
1. The former pastor was a demanded preacher and singer for which he recieved I would say a sizable income from his preaching out also he was an organizational official for year that probably(?) netted some income. Like mpst preachers of that era he probably dumped it all right back into the church. Pastor who teach the tithes belongs to the ministry(I believe that also) the majority pay most of the church bills and improvements and guest preachers out of the tithe. Years ago the tax professionals were telling us do NOT have two accounts. That has changed but I can see how a man 20 years or more to my senior might not comprehend the changes in the tax laws? Thus this unfortunate ordeal.

Hmm. Interesting. I am not sure that this post was intended to be written to me but nevertheless, I will answer.

I have never heard this before. The previous pastor in the church we pastored is probably 65 or so now. Pretty much the same age as the pastor who taught us carefully to abide by all the tax laws. The people who sued us were demanding that my husband pay the church land payment of $350.00 at 14% interest out of the tithe of $700.00 a month. We had just come from Home Missions, having started a church and paying all the bills for five years. We told them we were unable to carry another church and that we had been told we would be paid tithes when we took the church. To make a very long story short, we sold the land with a lawful vote of the church to get the church out from under the burden of it. The building they were in was falling apart and needed repairs. There was no money to fix it. Before the church split that happened a couple years before we arrived (over finances), the pastor and his wife were making around $45,000 a year with what I could piece together. They had drawn blueprints for a new building on the property, a huge building along with a school and many other things. What the pastor did not tell the congregation was that when he left all the funds were drained, all income was gone (there had been another income stream that had also dried up) and that there was less than $2000.00 in the coffers. When we got there, we simply had to be honest. There was no money. This was shocking to them and preachers in the area were also shocked. We were pretty much blamed for the lack of funds and sued.

I have an honest question. I hope that your position will not prevent you from answering honestly. Do you ever feel that in a church that has completely drained funds, that is it right and proper for a pastor to be spending funds from the expense account for his harley davidson motorcycle and american express bills in excess of $1000.00 a month (he was spending $4000.00 a month that we could piece together before the funds were drained)? Is there ever any excuse for this? To our way of thinking, it is ILLEGAL for a pastor to write personal checks from an expense account for personal items. This is what we had been taught. Is there any reason a district board would turn a blind eye to this? Would this be viewed as ILLEGAL, as we viewed it? Or would it be viewed as foolish and tsk, tsk. But not something they are going to delve into as a serious issue? If they did not delve into it, why not? Why would this not be seen as serious?

One thing I don't think I will ever understand is the lack of explanation, lack of returned phone calls, lack of communication on the parts of the previous pastor, district superintendent and presbyter.

My husband was ready to file a grievance against this pastor and take him before the district board when the presbyter called my husband and asked him not to because his wife had be diagnosed with stage four cancer. Well, then, what do you do? We washed our hands of it. Five months after his wife died, the previous pastor married his AIM interpreter.

Sister Alvear · #4 07-10-2012, 11:42 AM

sad...sad day when things like this happen...

Steve Epley · #5 07-10-2012, 11:49 AM

Also unless things changed in these later years the pastor lived a modest life and was a very humble loving man.

Sister Alvear · #6 07-10-2012, 12:15 PM

So true Elder Epley...I too knew the pastor and his wife...they were awesome people. I am sad that this is happening if it is...wish we knew both sides of the story...However and whatever...we can pray....

Falla39 · #7 07-10-2012, 12:21 PM

Above all, it is imparative that each member KEEP their heart
and spirit right!

Falla39

Cindy · #8 07-10-2012, 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Falla39

Above all, it is imparative that each member KEEP their heart
and spirit right!

Falla39

Yes!

StillStanding · #9 07-10-2012, 04:12 PM

Questions:
If the local preacher was the pastor's choice as next pastor, why didn't he mention it to the congregation, or to anybody else besides his daughter?

Why is the relationship between the daughter and the would- be pastor not relevant to this situation? Everyone in the church knows about it and talks about it. The previous pastor was very anti-remarriage, so wouldn't the daughter try keep any romantic relationship as secret as possible?

Comment
I would LOVE to hear the other side of this story! Will they allow an independent audit of the church's finances? I would LOVE to hear their explanation why they sent out the certified letters kicking out long time members of the church who happened to vote against the local preacher as pastor! I would LOVE to know why no unbiased outside preacher friend is being brought in to handle the process of finding a new pastor for the church!

I was told that it has gotten to he point where some members won't talk to each other, and the pro-local guy crowd is sitting on one side of the church and the anti-local guy crowd are sitting on the other side of the church! I can't help but smile thinking about how one side might try to out-spiritualize the other side! How will tongues and interpretation be handled?

CC1 · #10 07-10-2012, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StillStanding

I was told that it has gotten to he point where some members won't talk to each other, and the pro-local guy crowd is sitting on one side of the church and the anti-local guy crowd are sitting on the other side of the church! I can't help but smile thinking about how one side might try to out-spiritualize the other side! How will tongues and interpretation be handled?

Sounds like a recipe for revival to me!!!!