A Wrecked Church!

[Margies3]

Originally Posted by CC1

I had an uncle, deceased now, who was a Methodist in a small church in a small town. He very sincerely told me one day many years ago that they changed pastors every two or three years (I forget which) because if a pastor stayed any longer than that they got to know too much about you! LOL!!!

My husband grew up in a Methodist Church and we attended together for about 20 years. In this church, pastors typically stay for an average of 5-7 years. It all depends on the District Supt. and how they operate. We left this church because of the pastor about 8 or 9 years ago. The DS had brought someone in who was the worst pastor I have ever dealt with and then refused to move him out. When he came the church was running over 300. When he left 6 years later, the church is down to about 40 very elderly people.

As far as how to get the pastor out of the church we are discussing, my suggestions include:
1) Hold all tithes and offerings. Each person can put their money in a bank account of their own and then when the situation gets resolved, the money would be available to bail out the mess that will obviously happen when the church doesn't have the income it is accustomed to having. But don't give anything until the situation is resolved.
2) nothing says you have to stay for the sermon. When he gets up to preach, get up and leave.
3) I would suggest that the people hold onto all the positions they currently hold in the church and even try to get other positions. And then, dig your heals in. Do the things they way they SHOULD be done - legal and above-board, with excellence! Do it as unto the Lord and don't let this pastor or the daughter ram over-top of you. Make sure you have a strong backbone! It's gonna take one. Do NOT let this pastor or the daughter run things. Run things as a democracy - not a dictatorship.

That's the best I can think of. Praying for all of those involved. I understand how hard it is to be involved in a mess like this in a church. Been there, done that.

[Margies3]

The other suggestion I would have is to find out who is above this man and implore them to help you! Lay out the facts like they've been laid out here. Surely anyone who has a lick of spiritual sense would be able to see what's happened and what's needed!

[RandyWayne]

Originally Posted by Margies3

My husband grew up in a Methodist Church and we attended together for about 20 years. In this church, pastors typically stay for an average of 5-7 years. It all depends on the District Supt. and how they operate. We left this church because of the pastor about 8 or 9 years ago. The DS had brought someone in who was the worst pastor I have ever dealt with and then refused to move him out. When he came the church was running over 300. When he left 6 years later, the church is down to about 40 very elderly people.

As far as how to get the pastor out of the church we are discussing, my suggestions include:
1) Hold all tithes and offerings. Each person can put their money in a bank account of their own and then when the situation gets resolved, the money would be available to bail out the mess that will obviously happen when the church doesn't have the income it is accustomed to having. But don't give anything until the situation is resolved.
2) nothing says you have to stay for the sermon. When he gets up to preach, get up and leave.
3) I would suggest that the people hold onto all the positions they currently hold in the church and even try to get other positions. And then, dig your heals in. Do the things they way they SHOULD be done - legal and above-board, with excellence! Do it as unto the Lord and don't let this pastor or the daughter ram over-top of you. Make sure you have a strong backbone! It's gonna take one. Do NOT let this pastor or the daughter run things. Run things as a democracy - not a dictatorship.

That's the best I can think of. Praying for all of those involved. I understand how hard it is to be involved in a mess like this in a church. Been there, done that.

Along these lines, I've found that relentless heckling from the audience also gets the job done in short order. Watching some old stand up footage of Don Rickles should give anyone great material to get started.

[KeptByTheWord]

Originally Posted by Margies3

My husband grew up in a Methodist Church and we attended together for about 20 years. In this church, pastors typically stay for an average of 5-7 years. It all depends on the District Supt. and how they operate. We left this church because of the pastor about 8 or 9 years ago. The DS had brought someone in who was the worst pastor I have ever dealt with and then refused to move him out. When he came the church was running over 300. When he left 6 years later, the church is down to about 40 very elderly people.

As far as how to get the pastor out of the church we are discussing, my suggestions include:
1) Hold all tithes and offerings. Each person can put their money in a bank account of their own and then when the situation gets resolved, the money would be available to bail out the mess that will obviously happen when the church doesn't have the income it is accustomed to having. But don't give anything until the situation is resolved.
2) nothing says you have to stay for the sermon. When he gets up to preach, get up and leave.
3) I would suggest that the people hold onto all the positions they currently hold in the church and even try to get other positions. And then, dig your heals in. Do the things they way they SHOULD be done - legal and above-board, with excellence! Do it as unto the Lord and don't let this pastor or the daughter ram over-top of you. Make sure you have a strong backbone! It's gonna take one. Do NOT let this pastor or the daughter run things. Run things as a democracy - not a dictatorship.

That's the best I can think of. Praying for all of those involved. I understand how hard it is to be involved in a mess like this in a church. Been there, done that.

Great suggestions Margie! Praying that the Lord will reign in this situation.

[StillStanding]

Originally Posted by RandyWayne

Along these lines, I've found that relentless heckling from the audience also gets the job done in short order. Watching some old stand up footage of Don Rickles should give anyone great material to get started.

Funny response!

[ILG]

Originally Posted by CC1

Uh.....did you read the thread? They did pray and have a vote. The daughter's candidate for pastor was voted down. That vote was not honored. Instead enough of the ones voting against him were sent letters by the daughter kicking them out of the church so that when they hold a second vote he is assured to be elected!

So the element of the saints seeking Gods will, etc has been taken out of the equkation by the actions of the daughter.

You would think it would just be a whole lot easier for the daughter to have counted the ballots herself and avoided the whole "kicking out" part.

[Sarah]

Originally Posted by CC1

Uh.....did you read the thread? They did pray and have a vote. The daughter's candidate for pastor was voted down. That vote was not honored. Instead enough of the ones voting against him were sent letters by the daughter kicking them out of the church so that when they hold a second vote he is assured to be elected!

So the element of the saints seeking Gods will, etc has been taken out of the equkation by the actions of the daughter.

Yes, I did read the thread, CC1. Evidently everyone didn't pray and seek God's will. Namely the daughter! You're going to always have those who are troublemakers....and don't seek God. Hence the trouble they're going through...

[ILG]

Originally Posted by StillStanding

My reason for starting this thread was not to start gossip. It is perceived as such by some, and for those people I apologize.

My reason was to give a voice to the disenfranchised and bullied in a church situation that I believe to be a travesty. I have nothing personal to gain, but there's a lot I could lose. (friendships) That is why I choose to remain anonymous.

The only way that I saw to combat the powers that be, was to bring shame and perhaps political pressure from the outside. The church may go on as orchestrated, but at least I didn't stay silent while watching the church go up in flames.

I apologize for a couple of wrong assumptions:

1. The church has no board. The church has a Trustee board in place. Trustees are guardians of the church's assets. This means that all the church's properties may not be in the former pastor's name as was told to me.

2. No succession plan was in place. We were told by a member that it was the former pastor's wishes for the local pastor to take over as pastor. For one reason or another, the majority of church members were not receptive to this choice.

The motivation from current leadership is getting clearer to me. This local preacher was given the mantle from the former pastor, and the rebellious and gossiping members voted him down! They sincerely believe he is God's choice, and they will go to any and all means to accomplish what they feel is God's plan for the church. It's really amazing to see the lengths they have gone by sending certified letters to those who voted against the local preacher, telling them that they are no longer members of the church and they aren't welcomed back! They will soon have an "invitation only" church vote, and it appears that the cards are stacked.

Please help me pray for this church. A lot of people are hurting and it's a very emotional time for them. God bless!

The picture is becoming clearer. The daughter believes that her father's word (who she feels is the "man of God" whose word is law) is higher than any carnal vote. Apparently.

[ILG]

Originally Posted by RandyWayne

Along these lines, I've found that relentless heckling from the audience also gets the job done in short order. Watching some old stand up footage of Don Rickles should give anyone great material to get started.

Oh, that made me shudder. We've been on the receiving end of that relentless heckling.

[ILG]

I think people should just decide whether to stay and support the current ministry or leave. If 90% of the people leave and if the preacher and the daughter are in it for the money, they will move on.