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Old 11-08-2012, 01:54 PM
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Michael The Disciple Michael The Disciple is offline
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Obedience Essential To Life

Jesus didnt try to fool the people. He told them without keeping his sayings you will die.

52Then said the Jews unto him, Now we know that thou hast a devil. Abraham is dead , and the prophets; and thou sayest , If a man keep my saying, he shall never taste of death. John 8:52

Note the conditional nature of what he said. If you KEEP HIS SAYINGS you will not die.

Yet the Protestant doctrine is saturating the hearts of people. Teaching that one need NOT keep his sayings. You need not DO anything. They say if you DO anything its self righteousness.

Jesus did not think so. He said IF you keep his sayings you will not die.

Will it be life or death?

Last edited by Michael The Disciple; 11-08-2012 at 02:03 PM.
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Old 12-04-2012, 02:31 AM
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Michael The Disciple Michael The Disciple is offline
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Re: Obedience Essential To Life

A constant barrage of the doctrine of "unconditional love" has become a snare to the children of light. The teaching of personal holiness is becoming more and more scarce.

We are given two extremes.

1. Obey Pastors and mens traditions
2. Just believe Yeshua died for you on the cross. If you try to do ANYTHING at all you are adding works and are a legalist.

The truth of course is that we are saved by faith. That means we believe therefore we act upon the teachings given by the Christ. All that we do is because we are living by faith in him.

No one is assured a place in the kingdom just because Yeshua died on the cross. His death was that Gods wrath could be satisfied against the sins of our past. We are now to walk in newness of life.

There is a bottom line for gaining eternal life.

Walking by faith one must DO the will of God in order to obtain eternal life.

17And the world passeth away , and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever. 1 John 2:17

The great delusion of the end time is one need not do the will of God....ie keep the sayings or commandments of Yeshua to enter Heaven
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Old 12-04-2012, 07:29 AM
Aquila Aquila is offline
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Re: Obedience Essential To Life

Michael,

I agree with much of your post. But I have two things I'm not sure if I fully agree with you on. First, "unconditional love" brings the highest obligation to obedience. For God so loved the world... while we were yet sinners... that He gave His only begotten Son... who died for us. That's a love without conditions. "Whoseover" may come to Him, because He unconditionally loves all. And if THAT LOVE is in us... we unconditionally love God and others. To unconditionally love God brings the highest obligation to obedience. Because if we love God without conditions... we will do whatsoever He commands. Many say they love God... but it comes with conditions. They love God if God doesn't require too much time. They love God if God doesn't require too much sacrifice. They love God IF.... That's a conditional love. Agape brings an unconditional love towars God... and others. If we unconditionally love others, not seeking their approval, or any other condition, we'll tell them the truth in the hopes of saving their souls or setting them free. So, in my humble opinion... don't knock unconditional love. Sadly, what is taught in many circles today isn't unconditional love... it's license. License to virtually ignore God and what He asks of us.

So that was the first thing... the second thing is... and I think is the most important question...

Most devout Christians who love Jesus will agree that we must keep His sayings. But it breaks down immediately from there... because no one appears to know exactly what He was saying. What are His commands???

I was taught a list of man made rules and commandments offered out of covenantal contexts in the first church I attended. That is legalism. However, I've began to understand things differently. I could be wrong, I'm still growing spiritually. However, I'll share what I've come to believe...

First, we must abide in Christ... and Christ in us. Without Him... we can do nothing. We must establish a spiritual union with God. This is done through the Holy Ghost. It is no longer we ourselves who live... but Christ who lives within us. After receiving the Holy Ghost... we become one spirit with the LORD. A type of "oneness" with God. He ontologically lives IN us, that is, our spirits. That means that we are also one... in Him. I am one with you and you with me. Oneness... it's more than a Christology... it's the deepest spiritual reality. Through this oneness with God in Christ we allow God through the Spirit of Christ to live His life out in us. We become living extensions of Him. We become "branches"... He being the "true vine".

For many this is radical. They see the Holy Ghost coming to dwell in them as though He's a visitor in their hearts. No... I see it differently... the Holy Ghost comes to dwell in you... meaning in your very being. You become a drop of rain having fallen in the ocean of God's being... just as that rain drop becomes one with the ocean... we too become one with the LORD (in our spirits). Just as the branch and the vine are a single organism... we become one organism with Jesus, through the Spirit. The depths of this oneness with Him brings an infinite sense to our spirituality and spiritual experience. Our very identities have become... Christ. And our sanctification is our bringing our flesh under submission (mortifying the flesh) and our minds into alignment (putting on the mind of Christ); with this divine truth that we do not just believe in Jesus... but LIVE Jesus Himself, He being our very "life". The Christian life.

But that's my understanding of it. And it is grace that makes it possible.

Second, the commandments of Christ are the law of love. Love God with all your being... and love your neighbor as yourself. Love. Love. Love.

Love isn't license... but it is patient and kind. We love all, in spite of their imperfections and sin. However, we love them enough to call them to this salvation. As they experience Christ's very life flowing through them and begin to realize that He is their very identity... it no longer becomes an issue of following the rules of a church or pastor. It becomes an issue of "being Jesus". One cannot continue in sin and be like Jesus. If one is striving to be like Jesus... sin will be overcome and defeated. While the saint of God isn't absolutely perfect in behavior... they are perfected in their being, their inner man, the spirit. Sin's presence and power will fade in their lives.

That's my take on it. I know it's radical. The concept is ancient, very similar to the theosis taught in the Eastern churches of the ancient world, but without the ritual, dogma, and religion. It simply comes by... a true relationship with God. Being born again (Acts 2:38).

With this understanding... the baptism of the Holy Ghost becomes the single most important element of our lives. The baptism of the Holy Ghost becomes the single most important experience any soul can seek.

Please share your thoughts.

Last edited by Aquila; 12-04-2012 at 08:04 AM.
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Old 12-04-2012, 09:54 AM
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Esaias Esaias is offline
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Re: Obedience Essential To Life

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple View Post
Jesus didnt try to fool the people. He told them without keeping his sayings you will die.

52Then said the Jews unto him, Now we know that thou hast a devil. Abraham is dead , and the prophets; and thou sayest , If a man keep my saying, he shall never taste of death. John 8:52

Note the conditional nature of what he said. If you KEEP HIS SAYINGS you will not die.

Yet the Protestant doctrine is saturating the hearts of people. Teaching that one need NOT keep his sayings. You need not DO anything. They say if you DO anything its self righteousness.

Jesus did not think so. He said IF you keep his sayings you will not die.

Will it be life or death?
Actually, such antinomianism is NOT 'protestant doctrine'. the actual Protestant/Reformed doctrine is essentially that 'faith without works is dead' and that obedience is evidence of regeneration, sinfulness is evidence of being unregenerate.

The MODERNIST 'evangelical' nonsense unfortunately has eclipsed much of the religious world, leading many if not most straight to the lake of fire.
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