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Originally Posted by bishoph
Originally Posted by bishoph
Just to be clear......the AG and many other Pentecostal based groups teach that Holy Ghost baptism is distinct from and subsequent to salvation. Which is why nearly all of those groups believe that one is saved regardless of whether or not they EVER receive the spirit baptism or not. It is according to their teaching, something EVERY believer should seek for (to receive power) but not something they MUST have to be saved.
Also it is true that most Pentecostal based groups teach that speaking with tongues as the Spirit gives utterance is the initial evidence of receiving the Holy Ghost.
My question is......is there any other (initial) sign that one has received the Spirit? Or more directly, is speaking with tongues the ONLY biblical and universal (initial) sign or manifestation of one receiving the Holy Ghost?
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I would ask the question, who is demanding proof that one has received the Holy Ghost? Who needs this proof?
But, to answer your question concerning receiving the Spirit. Tongues sometime accompanied, sometimes didn't accompany the infilling of the Holy Ghost. John himself was filled with the Spirit in his mother's womb. Even John's father was filled with the Holy Ghost, but no tongues.
Act 11:15 And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning.
Act 11:16 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost.
Act 11:17 Forasmuch then as God gave them the like gift as he did unto us, who believed on the Lord Jesus Christ; what was I, that I could withstand God?
Act 11:18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.
Tongues sometimes, and sometimes does not, accompany the infilling of the Holy Ghost.
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And secondly, is there any biblical evidence that one can receive an indwelling presence/spirit separate/distinct from being baptized with the Holy Ghost?
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Isn't that what being baptized with the Holy Ghost is....receiving the indwelling presence/spirit of God? There is instance after instance in scripture where individuals were indwelled with the Spirit of God. Unless you're saying there's a difference between receiving the Spirit of God and being baptized with the Holy Ghost?
I need clarification before I can give a specific answer.
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