Well Technically Speaking....

[NotforSale]

Originally Posted by FlamingZword

Well any doctrine could be called a technicality, Whether a person goes to Hell or not for not properly doing this or that is not for us to decide, for he is the one that created the rules and it is him who decides how much he is willing to bend the rules to let some people into heaven.

Our goal should be to adhere as much as possible to his rules, not to think that his rules are simply suggestions.

That's the problem; defining the "RULES". Rules are what create Religion(s) and Religion eventually becomes darkness because of these Rules.

This is where Hell came from. You don't obey MY rules, you will go to Hell.

I don't understand why we continually revert to Old Testament ways, which was Religion gone rouge. You pick up sticks on the Sabbath, you will be stoned to death. You don't say the name of Jesus at baptism, you go to Hell.

[RandyWayne]

Originally Posted by CC1

I have only read your initial post in this thread but I can tell you right off the bat that most old time Pentecostals answer would be that one mans "technicality" may be God's "necessity"!

This is very true. This is why we have a small % that baptism must be done using only the Hebrew word for Jesus. Still others believe that it must be done in a river -something about the moving water removing sins.

On the subject of "Jesus name" in baptism, I have wondered how many would be uncomfortable being baptized by a man (whether he is their pastor or not) who has a speech impediment? Just how much could someone verbally mangle the word "Jesus" until it suddenly didn't count as a valid baptism in Gods eyes?

[FlamingZword]

Originally Posted by NotforSale

That's the problem; defining the "RULES". Rules are what create Religion(s) and Religion eventually becomes darkness because of these Rules.

This is where Hell came from. You don't obey MY rules, you will go to Hell.

I don't understand why we continually revert to Old Testament ways, which was Religion gone rouge. You pick up sticks on the Sabbath, you will be stoned to death. You don't say the name of Jesus at baptism, you go to Hell.

well I could listen to you or I could listen to Jesus, who said
He that believed and is baptized shall be saved.

Between listening to you and listening to Jesus, who do you think I choose.

[Sasha]

I see people saying that works doesn't save, and to that alone, I agree, however, one cannot be saved without works if you believe the Bible.

God says faith without works is dead. You can have faith, which is an absolute for salvation, but without works, it's a dead faith. I don't see any examples in scripture where anyone was saved having dead faith.

That being said, I also don't believe anyone has to say anything at a baptism. Jesus calls on us to be baptized and to call on His name. There is nothing that says the preacher has to say anything during a baptism.

If we have faith, a true live faith, works will go hand in hand with that faith.

I don't believe anyone will be in heaven, claiming they did nothing but have faith.

[seekerman]

Originally Posted by FlamingZword

Between listening to you and listening to Jesus, who do you think I choose.

Jesus didn't teach that His blood was imputed to one person according to the baptismal actions of another person.

[Jason B]

Originally Posted by FlamingZword

well I could listen to you or I could listen to Jesus, who said
He that believed and is baptized shall be saved.

Between listening to you and listening to Jesus, who do you think I choose.

Amen. Not4Sale basically wants us to believe we have no Word from God in this world, but then speaks as if his options are divine. Hmmmm, whose the real authority here? Postmodernism at its finest and deadliest.

[Jason B]

Originally Posted by NotforSale

That's the problem; defining the "RULES". Rules are what create Religion(s) and Religion eventually becomes darkness because of these Rules.

This is where Hell came from. You don't obey MY rules, you will go to Hell.

I don't understand why we continually revert to Old Testament ways, which was Religion gone rouge. You pick up sticks on the Sabbath, you will be stoned to death. You don't say the name of Jesus at baptism, you go to Hell.

This coming from a guy who doesn't believe the Bible is Gods Word, doesn't believe salvation is exclusively through Jesus Christ, doesn't believe in hell, and believes in some form of universalism. Hmmm.

[NotforSale]

Originally Posted by Jason Badejo

This coming from a guy who doesn't believe the Bible is Gods Word, doesn't believe salvation is exclusively through Jesus Christ, doesn't believe in hell, and believes in some form of universalism. Hmmm.

You make plenty of accusations here without backing up your assumptions. It's the same ole, same ole, coming from someone who thinks they know what God is saying in a Religion that is just like any other.

What voices are you hearing in your head today?

I could give you the facts until I'm blue in the face and you still wouldn't believe the TRUTH (If you dare, read the link below). You follow your own ideas, your own culture, and your own dogmas; face it, you know it's the TRUTH that you are a byproduct of another man's byproduct, afraid to embark on a journey outside the Box of that byproduct!

You believe what you believe because someone else has told you what to believe, and your fear of changing will keep you in the harbor of lies.

On the subject of Hell; The Old Testament does not support or teach about Eternal Damnation. The Jews do not believe in Eternal Damnation. But to the amazement of the World of Faith, TA DA, this little stinker sneaks in the back door via The Roman Catholic Church, with all of their little idols!!!

Yeah buddy, it's all about the FEAR! The FEAR of the unseen! Instead of throwing stones at someone for picking up sticks, we throw them into HELL when they make, one wrong, move! Using Hell is another figure of modern age stoning, and is the greatest form of manipulation ever known to a Religion!

Why don't people get it? Hell, or Eternal Damnation, was a part of other Religions far before Christianity ever existed. JB, get out of the Dark Ages.

http://www.tentmaker.org/articles/ifhellisreal.htm

[NotforSale]

Originally Posted by FlamingZword

well I could listen to you or I could listen to Jesus, who said
He that believed and is baptized shall be saved.

Between listening to you and listening to Jesus, who do you think I choose.

You are listening to yourself.

[Jason B]

Originally Posted by NotforSale

You make plenty of accusations here without backing up your assumptions. It's the same ole, same ole, coming from someone who thinks they know what God is saying in a Religion that is just like any other.

What voices are you hearing in your head today?

I could give you the facts until I'm blue in the face and you still wouldn't believe the TRUTH (If you dare, read the link below). You follow your own ideas, your own culture, and your own dogmas; face it, you know it's the TRUTH that you are a byproduct of another man's byproduct, afraid to embark on a journey outside the Box of that byproduct!

You believe what you believe because someone else has told you what to believe, and your fear of changing will keep you in the harbor of lies.

On the subject of Hell; The Old Testament does not support or teach about Eternal Damnation. The Jews do not believe in Eternal Damnation. But to the amazement of the World of Faith, TA DA, this little stinker sneaks in the back door via The Roman Catholic Church, with all of their little idols!!!

Yeah buddy, it's all about the FEAR! The FEAR of the unseen! Instead of throwing stones at someone for picking up sticks, we throw them into HELL when they make, one wrong, move! Using Hell is another figure of modern age stoning, and is the greatest form of manipulation ever known to a Religion!

Why don't people get it? Hell, or Eternal Damnation, was a part of other Religions far before Christianity ever existed. JB, get out of the Dark Ages.

http://www.tentmaker.org/articles/ifhellisreal.htm

So out of everything I said all you can respond with is there is no hell?

Listen you haven't presented me with anything new. I'm not dogmatic about the specifics of hell. But I do know that the unrighteous will not inherit the Kingdom of God and will be forever separated Him. If you don't believe that then you on what authority should I accept your opinions over the Bible? What credibility do you have vs the Word of God? If were going by our own reason and logic, then I like mine a lot better than yours. And I'll take Paul's statements over yours.