John Macarthur: Pentecostals Are Lost!

[Originalist]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Ever since McArther got publicly rebuked for his Logos Theology (Denied the Eternal Son doctrine), and changed his stance, he has been like this. He is trying to fit in with a certain segment of Evangelicalism

Agreed.

[Michael The Disciple]

I often have discussions with Evangelicals on Paltalk.com. This week they really came on strong telling me I had never "trusted Christ alone" for salvation.

They explained that to their thinking very completely. When they say to trust Christ alone they mean that if you pray the sinners prayer sincerely you are forgiven not just of past sin but all sins you will ever commit right then!

I told them I accepted Christ as my Savior in 1974 but they said unless I had "accepted Christ alone" in the sense of believing in once saved always saved I was NOT saved.

Phil Johnson in his discussion with Michael Brown uses that very same terminology "trust Christ alone". In my opinion this is one of the most deadly heresies going.

When you speak of holiness they recoil. They took away my mic several times raining down accusations. It is truly eye opening when you really understand their version of "the gospel".

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

I often have discussions with Evangelicals on Paltalk.com. This week they really came on strong telling me I had never "trusted Christ alone" for salvation.

They explained that to their thinking very completely. When they say to trust Christ alone they mean that if you pray the sinners prayer sincerely you are forgiven not just of past sin but all sins you will ever commit right then!

I told them I accepted Christ as my Savior in 1974 but they said unless I had "accepted Christ alone" in the sense of believing in once saved always saved I was NOT saved.

Phil Johnson in his discussion with Michael Brown uses that very same terminology "trust Christ alone". In my opinion this is one of the most deadly heresies going.

When you speak of holiness they recoil. They took away my mic several times raining down accusations. It is truly eye opening when you really understand their version of "the gospel".

It's funny but according to a lot of people one "sign" of a cult is Elitism.

[Sabby]

Originally Posted by Originalist

The GOSPEL is the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ. These steps he took earned him the right to be called Lord and to be our justifier (by his blood) and baptizer in the Holy Ghost. That is the gospel.



The correct response in faith to the above message is to repent, be baptized into the authority (name) of Jesus Christ, burying our old man with him being baptized into his death. Then God gives us regeneration/eternal life by way of the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Charnock has a point in that many Apostolics (you included) completely skip actually declaring the gospel and preach Peter's command in Acts 2:38 as the gospel, with no explanation as to what necessitated those "steps". Thus we have shallow converts who are more in love with the "steps" than they are Christ. They find their full spiritual identity in the "steps" (the "truth") and have a very stunted experience and relationship with God.

Man, you be smackin' down the brother!

The gospel = the Life, the death, burial, resurrection of Jesus Christ and subsequent hope of eternity, provided as a gift and appropriated by our repentant response to the message.

[Sabby]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Ever since McArther got publicly rebuked for his Logos Theology (Denied the Eternal Son doctrine), and changed his stance, he has been like this. He is trying to fit in with a certain segment of Evangelicalism

You're probably right, Prax. He had that civil lawsuit years ago, went "underground" for awhile - and came out guns a'blazin', writing commentaries, study bibles, etc. He is the voice of Baptist cessationism.

[Originalist]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

I often have discussions with Evangelicals on Paltalk.com. This week they really came on strong telling me I had never "trusted Christ alone" for salvation.

They explained that to their thinking very completely. When they say to trust Christ alone they mean that if you pray the sinners prayer sincerely you are forgiven not just of past sin but all sins you will ever commit right then!

I told them I accepted Christ as my Savior in 1974 but they said unless I had "accepted Christ alone" in the sense of believing in once saved always saved I was NOT saved.

Phil Johnson in his discussion with Michael Brown uses that very same terminology "trust Christ alone". In my opinion this is one of the most deadly heresies going.

When you speak of holiness they recoil. They took away my mic several times raining down accusations. It is truly eye opening when you really understand their version of "the gospel".

Those people never seem to think about what Paul says will happen to those who "trust" in Christ......

13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, (Eph 1;13)

When this Ephesian church was founded in Acts 19, we see these very things happening to them that Paul mentions here in the epistle....

19 And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples,

2 He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.

3 And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism.

4 Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.

5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.

So, just as Paul described in Ephesians 1, they heard the message and trusted Christ. They responded in faith by being baptized in his name. Then God sealed them with the Holy Ghost.

When did this happen to those Evangelicals that trouble you now? I'd like to see how they respond to this.

[Originalist]

Originally Posted by Sabby

Man, you be smackin' down the brother!

The gospel = the Life, the death, burial, resurrection of Jesus Christ and subsequent hope of eternity, provided as a gift and appropriated by our repentant response to the message.

Thanks for the affirmation. But please remember I say those things as a "three stepper".

[Praxeas]

It's sort of the new "Club" started with Walter Martin but the IRONY is the former Bible Answer man is considered a heretic for denying the Eternal Son doctrine too

[Abiding Now]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

It's sort of the new "Club" started with Walter Martin but the IRONY is the former Bible Answer man is considered a heretic for denying the Eternal Son doctrine too

Please elaborate.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Abiding Now

Please elaborate.

Martin and at one point Macarthur both denied the Son Eternally existed as the Son but instead Eternally existed as the Logos who became the Son.

In WMs debate with Sabin he made this same argument and tried to "railroad" the other Trinitarian debater to agree, but he did not actually agree.