Why Do You Believe Jesus is God?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by jfrog

Stop acting like we are not dealing with that passage.

Sorry. You aren't.

You have not explained why the Alpha and Omega is both the one who died and is alive (Jesus), and the Almighty. You just dodge the issue and go to Rev 22. I addressed Rev 22, which you claim I did not.

You, on the other hand, applied the principle of me saying Jesus is both the Almighty and the one who died and rose again to the Rev 22 chapter, which I debunked. But you did not explain why He is both Almighty and the resurrected one. Please do so! The focus of my point is THE ALMIGHTY reference.

That's silly. What I just stated was dealing with your proposed evidence.

You dealt with with general thought but never gave one explanation as to why Jesus would be called Almighty.

Only GOD is Almighty. Jesus is not AN Almighty. But THE Almighty. There are not a multitude of Almighties. Just one.

Now let me answer your objection to my proposed answer, that the angel was quoting Jesus in Revelation 22. Let's take it verse by verse.

6 And he said unto me, These sayings are faithful and true: and the Lord God of the holy prophets sent his angel to shew unto his servants the things which must shortly be done. (So the angel is quoting Jesus here when he references the Lord God sending his angel)

7 Behold, I come quickly: blessed is he that keepeth the sayings of the prophecy of this book. (The angel is quoting Jesus saying he will come quickly)

8 And I John saw these things, and heard them. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down to worship before the feet of the angel which shewed me these things. (John worships the angel)

9 Then saith he unto me, See thou do it not: for I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren the prophets, and of them which keep the sayings of this book: worship God. (The angel speaks for the angel and tells John not to worship him)

10 And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand. (The angel goes back to speaking for Jesus)

11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still. (Still speaking for Jesus)

12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be. (Still speaking for Jesus)

13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last. (Still speaking for Jesus)

14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. (Still speaking for Jesus)

15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie. (Still speaking for Jesus)

16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star. (Still speaking for Jesus)

Okay, Your explanation makes sense.

Sure does!

Walks in Islam said that the ANGEL in Rev 1:1 was JESUS, Hiimself. I disagreed. And He insisted, and cited Rev 22 as evidence, like you have done. But if the angel is Jesus, then it wreaks havoc on what Rev 22:16 says about Jesus SENDING HIS ANGEL. The only way Jesus could say He sent His angel was for the Angel in Rev 1:1 to not be Jesus but THIS DISTINCT being called the angel whom he sent in Rev 22.

Rev 22:16 demands that the angel in Rev 1:1 NOT BE JESUS.

However, you just gave me the greatest counter to Revelation 1:8 and any other passages where you claim Jesus speaks as if he is God. Let me give you a sample:[/B]

Revelation 1:8 8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty. (Explanation: This passage is Jesus speaking for God)

The only way you could come to that conclusion is to WANT TO DISBELIEVE THAT JESUS IS GOD.

So now just like the claim the angel was speaking for Jesus when the angel makes a claim you believe should only apply to Jesus, just like that I am going to claim that if Jesus makes a claim that sounds like something that should only apply to God that Jesus was simply speaking for God just like you claim the angel was speaking for Jesus. Consistency I love thee soo...

Wrong. You WANT a way out for some odd reason, likely due to pride of not being wrong.

There is a good solid reason why Jesus is not the angel in Rev 22. A solid piece of evidence that disallows it. Verse 16!!! There is nothing like that in chapter 1.

And notice how I debunked Rev 22 issue, and you see it! So you STILL jump back to Rev 1 and find some grain of a loophole. It's my own argument of Rev 22! You really do not want to believe Jesus is God, do you? Even at the cost of seeing your argument of Rev 22 debunked.