Original Sin

[thephnxman]

Originally Posted by Lafon

The answer is found in understanding the "seed," a principle that God established in the beginning. All things would, including mankind, continue its presence by means of the "seed" that was present within itself.
When Adam sinned and God imposed the judgment of death upon his body, then this meant that the "seed" of all humanity became corrupt, and because the "seed" of all things God created is reproduced after its own kind, then we, as with all mankind born of Adam's "seed" have inherited Adam's propensity (call it "nature" if you will) to sin, as well as inherited the penalty of death by this same means.
Christ Jesus' progenitor was NOT the corrupted "seed" of Adam, rather that of the Spirit, therefore He did not inherit a "propensity" (aka, "nature") to sin, although because His fleshly body was formed in and came out of sinful flesh, then after this manner He, like all of humanity, inherited the penalty of death. This is why the Hebrews writer tells us that it "behoved" (that is, was necessary) for Him to be made like unto His brethren.
So bottom line ...... It is all in the "seed."

The "Third Law of Creation" explains the seed in man very well. However, Jesus was
born of the seed of the woman, hence he DID NOT inherit the propensity to sin. The
resurrection is proof that Jesus did not sin, because death could not hold him ("...the
soul that sins shall die..."). The only penalty Jesus incurred was for OUR sins.

Yes! "It is all in the seed."

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Let's deal with it here if we can. Again, my issue is that if Adam did not make us sinners then Christ did not make us righteous.

Do you believe Christ made us righteous without our good works?

bump

[thephnxman]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Let's deal with it here if we can. Again, my issue is that if Adam did not make us sinners then Christ did not make us righteous.
Do you believe Christ made us righteous without our good works?

I submit that "original sin" was dealt with at the cross.
The prophet said, "In sin did my mother conceive me..." (sic: I was conceived
in my mother's womb). Sin was inherited through Adam, and the prophet's own parents.
Additionally, we do not inherit our fathers' sins for "...the father shall not
bear the sins of the son, neither shall the son bear the sins of the father."
Today, we did not inherit Adam's sin; only his propensity to sin.

Your question is dubious: the Lord's sacrifice is moot unless we "Repent, and be baptized
everyone of you in the NAME of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and you shall
receive the gift of the Holy Spirit." So we are made righteous BY HIS good works;
furthermore, man are OFFERED His righteousness via the cross.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by thephnxman

I submit that "original sin" was dealt with at the cross.
The prophet said, "In sin did my mother conceive me..." (sic: I was conceived
in my mother's womb). Sin was inherited through Adam, and the prophet's own parents.
Additionally, we do not inherit our fathers' sins for "...the father shall not
bear the sins of the son, neither shall the son bear the sins of the father."
Today, we did not inherit Adam's sin; only his propensity to sin.

Your question is dubious: the Lord's sacrifice is moot unless we "Repent, and be baptized
everyone of you in the NAME of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and you shall
receive the gift of the Holy Spirit." So we are made righteous BY HIS good works;
furthermore, man are OFFERED His righteousness via the cross.

I agree righteousness comes only through the work of the cross. By His good works. Why did you say my question was dubious? I am not universalist.

[thephnxman]

Originally Posted by mfblume

I agree righteousness comes only through the work of the cross. By His good works. Why did you say my question was dubious? I am not universalist.

Beloved, I did not understand where the question was coming from: so I only answered as I felt it was meant.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by thephnxman

Beloved, I did not understand where the question was coming from: so I only answered as I felt it was meant.

Ok. Thanks.

The question came from the claim some believe Adam did not make us sinners.

[mfblume]

Wow, this is really dragging.

So.... those who believe Adam did not make us sinners, what do you say about your idea that I claim demands we make ourselves righteous?

[mfblume]

I guess there is no response here from those who think Adam did not make us sinners when presented with the demand for us to save ourselves by works if that be the case, according to Romans 5.

[thephnxman]

Perhaps the horse is dead and the stick has
been worn down to a toothpick.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by thephnxman

Perhaps the horse is dead and the stick has
been worn down to a toothpick.

But nobody addressed the actual issue. I can only say those who feel Adam did not make us sinners perhaps may realize that such a belief demands salvation by works, and they have no answer. But likely they'll keep believing Adam did not make us sinners anyway. Usually works that way. Just sweep that detail of the demand to preach salvation by works under the carpet.