God commanded the Israelites to shout and battles were won. There's Biblical principle in this, not just scientific evidence. The reason I posted about the scientific proof is because people were questioning whether it was true. Like it or not, God has used various means through which to show His power and might, including the command to shout.
As to Stoneking, watch the video. He stated: "God spoke to me just about 30 minutes ago and told me that if you would do a certain thing, that He would totally deliver you from all fear and inhibitions." He then gave reference to the Old Testament, when God commanded His people to shout. After this, he related the information about sound waves, "shredding" the air, etc.
If you have issue with this, then you have issue with God's commands to the children of Israel in the Old Testament.
I can say that before out kids went to NAYC they were pretty inhibited. since they came back, they have been far more involved in the regular worship and alter prayer times. so while im seriously NOT an LS fanboy, for our kids, they came home from that event changed.
and remember this. LS got 5 minutes. this was 5 minutes out of the entire conference.
They did not spend an entire conference teaching yell class.
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
I've had some memorable times in my walk with God. There are memorials built which include times of deep prayer and crying out to God. And there have been at least two very memorable times when a shout caused my situation to turn around. Sitting there quietly meditating or quietly praying would not have done it. It was the praise, it was the shout that turned it around.
So all this criticism of what happened at NAYC blows my mind. It shouldn't because, well, this is AFF, but I'm still surprised when this happens.
"The Kingdom of Heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force."
You try doing that, sitting there whispering your little prayers.
I've had some memorable times in my walk with God. There are memorials built which include times of deep prayer and crying out to God. And there have been at least two very memorable times when a shout caused my situation to turn around. Sitting there quietly meditating or quietly praying would not have done it. It was the praise, it was the shout that turned it around.
So all this criticism of what happened at NAYC blows my mind. It shouldn't because, well, this is AFF, but I'm still surprised when this happens.
"The Kingdom of Heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force."
You try doing that, sitting there whispering your little prayers.
Thanks for the scripture, which garners FAITH.
What was on your mind, in your hour of need, while sitting or kneeling? Was this what you were thinking about?
"With a little study, I found out that there is something about the human voice, that when it shouts it shreds the air."
Notice the focus is horizontal - "the human voice".
Everything else he said was scriptural and correct. This little element raises a red flag in my mind. It promotes sensationalism. Sensationalism is not intellectually honest.
The focus of this thread is not on the merits of NAYC. It is about this one statement that doesn't sound well at all.
Would you use this in a lesson? Would you teach this to your children? I wouldn't go near it with a ten foot pole.
What was on your mind, in your hour of need, while sitting or kneeling? Was this what you were thinking about?
"With a little study, I found out that there is something about the human voice, that when it shouts it shreds the air."
Notice the focus is horizontal - "the human voice".
Everything else he said was scriptural and correct. This little element raises a red flag in my mind. It promotes sensationalism. Sensationalism is not intellectually honest.
The focus of this thread is not on the merits of NAYC. It is about this one statement that doesn't sound well at all.
Would you use this in a lesson? Would you teach this to your children? I wouldn't go near it with a ten foot pole.
I understood what Stoneking was saying. I didn't miss the whole lead up to that point in which he laid the Biblical foundation.
What did the children of Israel use when God commanded them to shout? It wasn't just faith! It was their human voice.
I highly doubt Stoneking believes it's only our human voice which does anything. Yes, it's faith, but faith without works is dead. You can have all the faith in the world, and it will do absolutely nothing if not put into action. And until we're in heaven, we have human bodies which means we use human means --- through faith.
Again, the Kingdom of Heaven suffereth violence and the violent take it by force. This is not a quiet, passive scene. This paints a very loud, very intense picture. So, yes, I would use the example. The reason is because it's something we can all understand. Tell 20,000 kids that God commanded people to shout and things happened and they'll praise God for what he did. Tell them that sound waves dispell molecules in the air and they now have something they can really grasp and understand.
Stoneking simply used a physical or scientific example to relate a spiritual truth or principle. People use personal experiences, practical or scientific examples all the time. Why is this any different?
Tell 20,000 kids that God commanded people to shout and things happened and they'll praise God for what he did. Tell them that sound waves dispell molecules in the air and they now have something they can really grasp and understand.
.
So, what you just said is that sensationalism, among the youth, will always win against solid scriptural exegesis.
How sad...
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Last edited by Pressing-On; 09-01-2015 at 10:22 AM.
So, what you just said is that sensationalism, among the youth, will always wins against solid scriptural exegesis.
How sad...
Not at all what I said. Not at all. That statement there shows you've completely ignored the "solid scriptural exegesis" Stoneking gave preceeding the example he gave. You're now just putting words in my mouth.
What I said was that putting Biblical principles into examples they know and understand helps when it comes to Biblical stories like this. It's not sensationalism, it's simply relating something in a way the audience can understand.
Not at all what I said. Not at all. That statement there shows you've completely ignored the "solid scriptural exegesis" Stoneking gave preceeding the example he gave. You're now just putting words in my mouth.
What I said was that putting Biblical principles into examples they know and understand helps when it comes to Biblical stories like this. It's not sensationalism, it's simply relating in a way the audience can understand.
No, that is what you said. Read it again. You gave them a choice of what they had more confidence in - scripture or sensationalism.
Quote:
Originally Posted by n david
Tell 20,000 kids that God commanded people to shout and things happened and they'll praise God for what he did. Tell them that sound waves dispell molecules in the air and they now have something they can really grasp and understand.
This whole thread has been about this one statement and the "sensationalism" involved. You just proved that point.
No, that is what you said. Read it again. You gave them a choice of what they had more confidence in - scripture or sensationalism.
This whole thread has been about this one statement and the "sensationalism" involved. You just proved that point.
Word.
I've enjoyed not arguing with you for a long while now, but I won't sit and allow you to add, twist, hack or spin what I posted. I did not post that giving these kinds of examples shows confidence in sensationalism over scripture. You're completely wrong on what I posted.
I'm on God's side. He commanded His people to shout for the victory many times throughout the Bible. You can sit in a seat and whisper a prayer if you wish. God will answer your prayer and my praise. Don't bash the praise and I won't bash the whispered prayers.
the whole thread is about 5 minutes during an entire conference that went on for what? 2 or 3 days?
Ferdinand, The topic of the thread is not about the 2 or 3 days. It is not on the merits of NAYC2015.
This thread is solely focused on the ridiculous statement made by Stoneking, which I greatly oppose as "sensationalism". I was fine with what he was saying until he got here:
"With a little study, I found out that there is something about the human voice, that when it shouts it shreds the air."
I refuse to support the statement.
I didn't need to go outside the Bible to study that my FAITH moves God, for heaven's sake. I will not allow anyone discussing the merits of shouting and praise to focus on "decibel levels" with me. I will not teach this to my children nor my grandchildren.
I believe in the supernatural. I believe in being natural and letting God be super.
Part the Red Sea, drop the walls of Jericho. It was God alone not the children of Israel. The walls fell because of their obedience and faith. It had nothing to do with the "decibel level" of their voices. What a bunch of hogwash.
Not at all. That statement there shows you've completely ignored the "solid scriptural exegesis" Stoneking gave preceeding the example he gave. You're now just putting words in my mouth.
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