Some standing here - Page 39

Sean · #**381** 10-22-2015, 08:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

No Sean you are the one making a mockery of the word of God, when you say Christ is going to have a literal sword sticking out of his mouth when he returns. Or that God is Going to have his angles collect millions of people and pile them up outside Jerusalem and squash them until the blood flows as high as a horses bridle.

First off Sean if God were to do that the bodies of millions of people would cover such a vast area of the middle east it would fill the land, let along the blood would fill a reservoir much deeper and bigger than what is described in scripture. You cannot have it both ways, the only thing EB is trying to get you to see is just that. It is a physical impossibility, "the wine press". Yes God can do anything, but God also limits himself within the natural laws that he himself set in creation.

Believing the exact words are MOCKING?

Sean · #**382** 10-22-2015, 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

Oh common Sean you are smarter than that, or maybe not. You think that the cloven tongues are fulfillment of those passages? Now who is speaking in metaphors?

A manifestation is NOT a metaphor.

Godsdrummer · #**383** 10-22-2015, 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sean

This is how preterists prep you for re-interpretation folks....

Revelation 12King James Version (KJV)

Look what Sean believes!

12 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:

Quote:

He has a pregnant women with the sun as a robe, standing on the moon

.

2 And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.

3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.

Quote:

Wait it gets better, now a great big dragon appears in heaven, can we see this dragon, or this woman? And the dragon has seven heads, with ten horns, and seven crowns on his head. The dragon is in heaven, and the woman is standing on the moon. Wow

4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.

Quote:

Don't stop, stay with me, because the dragon throws a third of the stars from the heaven and cast them to the earth. Something in itself that would destroy the earth completely.

5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

Quote:

Wait the earth is destroyed because of the stars, yet the man child is going to rule the earth with a rod of iron? What earth? No no, no, the child is caught up to God and to his throne. So he does not come to earth anyway.

6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

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Wait I am confused now, the woman that is robed in the sun, and stands on the moon, flees to the wilderness, is this on earth or in heaven?

7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

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Not sure which is better, that this war was in heaven and not the earth. But then with the stars falling to earth, there is not much left on earth.

8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.

9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

Quote:

Well I guess the earth is as good a place as any to cast the dragon to now.

10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

Quote:

Yeah salvation has come, but wait I thought salvation came 2000 years ago.
Oh wait, I think I get it, everyone before this time had to die for their sins because even after the cross they loved not their lives unto death.
They still died.

11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.

Quote:

Ok we now have people in the heavens, and somehow inhabiters on earth even after the stars being cast upon the earth. But here is the biggie, the woman is on the earth because now the dragon persecutes her.

14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

15 And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.

16 And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.

17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Preterists....."ha ha ha, ho ho ho, he he he....can you believe this stuff? This must mean something else class. This stuff makes no sense at all, when reading it. Lets' look around the rest of the Bible for similar words and get to the "real" meaning, Lets' use metaphors. They are open-ended in interpretation, therefore we can say what we want without any reprocussions"

Sean I just notes a few things in this passage, maybe you could enlighten us on your view like you did Matt 24, because that is a big dragon and for that matter so is the woman if she is robed in the sun and stands on the moon. And just where is the sun while the woman is wearing the sun?

Godsdrummer · #**384** 10-22-2015, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sean

A manifestation is NOT a metaphor.

The cloven tongues were not a manifestation of the kingdom of God.

Sean · #**385** 10-22-2015, 08:38 AM

Okay bro.....you will se comparisons, not metaphors of something else by me. I only seek to clarify the passage.

Revelation 12
12 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:(Israel)

2 And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.(seeking the 2nd coming)

3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.(satan)

4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.

5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.(Jesus)

6 And the woman(Israel) fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.(notice that God saves Israel, not destroys her?)

7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.

9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.(many saints will perish as seen in Rev 14,)

12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.(Israel)

14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.(Israel saved by God)

15 And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.

16 And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.(Israel saved by God)

17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.(Jews attacked by satan)

Please notice, that I allowed the symbols to interpret the passage.

I have not wrote a big commentary, but used very little explanation to help you understand what the minor symbolism is telling us about the passage.

This is the best way to view the Book of Revelations.

Sean · #**386** 10-22-2015, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

The cloven tongues were not a manifestation of the kingdom of God.

Yes it was, that is why it was VISIBLE, once and ONLY once.

Bowas · #**387** 10-22-2015, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sean

Yes it was, that is why it was VISIBLE, once and ONLY once.

So that was Jesus coming back in like manner as he departed? Is that what you are saying?

Sean · #**388** 10-22-2015, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bowas

So that was Jesus coming back in like manner as he departed? Is that what you are saying?

No, it was this.....

John 14:18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.

Sean · #**389** 10-22-2015, 08:44 AM

11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven....

2nd coming.