Once Saved Always Saved

[jfrog]

Originally Posted by kclee4jc

To answer your question...un repented sin condemns to hell...period.

Who here believes that it's important to walk before God with a pure heart and a clean conscience?

Is the forgiveness? Certainly. The bible tells us how to attain it.
I John 1:9
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

If it were not possible to walk before God in holiness the John would have never written "that ye sin not" . Yet, recognizing that flesh is prone to wander he also wrote "but if any man sin."

I'm thankful for God's mercy if I do sin and confess it before him, and I'm thankful for the day by day walk in the Spirit that is able to keep me from sinning.

I tell people" if you sin everyday then you need to pray through". I believe holiness is sinlessness.

I find it fascinating that you would condemn yourself to hell. I must ask, have you yet asked for God's forgiveness for all the times you have driven faster than the speed limit?

[jfrog]

Originally Posted by good samaritan

To walk around with realization that there is always forgiveness of sin is wrong.

So you believe there is a time at which God will stop forgiving a man?

I thought Jesus blood coveres all sins no matter how big or how many?

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

Our single widowed neighbor, who is a staunch Baptist, had a discussion with us where she said she believes in once saved always saved. We had a discussion about how we view it. She did not really have any scripture to back up her position, but said she was going home to study it, and present it to us at a later time.

What is the best way to refute this doctrine?

We took her to Revelation where Jesus was speaking to the churches, and it was quite obvious that they were believers, and yet he was rebuking them strongly, and if they didn't repent, he would "spue them out of his mouth". Her response to this was that they were never believers in the first place for this to happen. This is the card they play to get out of the concept of not being once saved always saved.

Any scriptures, pointers or ideas/concepts in which it can be discussed with her that we can't just live recklessly after our faith in Jesus, and still expect to be saved? She is not doing that of course - she loves the Lord dearly, and I believe the Lord has led her to come into our path to lead her to more truth. I just want to handle this carefully. She has been coming to our home group meetings, and she has expressed how wonderful it is to gather like this, and feel the sweet spirit of the Lord in our meetings. We believe the Lord wants to lead her on to greater truth.

Col 1:23if indeed you remain grounded and steadfast in the faith and are not shifted away from the hope of the gospel that you heard (unless you performed glossololia down at an altar, disregarding "as the spirit gives utterance," in which case you are immune).

[good samaritan]

Originally Posted by jfrog

So you believe there is a time at which God will stop forgiving a man?

I thought Jesus blood coveres all sins no matter how big or how many?

I do not draw lines, but God is the judge of our hearts and where his mercy continues. We cannot use Gods' grace as an excuse for complacency, and we cannot take his grace for granite.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by jfrog

So you believe there is a time at which God will stop forgiving a man?

I thought Jesus blood coveres all sins no matter how big or how many?

The bible speaks of trampling on the blood.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by mfblume

The bible speaks of trampling on the blood.

Hebrews 10:29 is speaking of blaspheming the Holy Ghost.

How much severer punishment do you think he will deserve who has trampled under foot the Son of God, and has regarded as unclean the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has INSULTED the Spirit of grace?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Hebrews 10:29 is speaking of blaspheming the Holy Ghost.

How much severer punishment do you think he will deserve who has trampled under foot the Son of God, and has regarded as unclean the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has INSULTED the Spirit of grace?

[good samaritan]

The writer of Hebrews 10 is comparing the severity of disobedience in Moses day according to the law with those in the church. The people in the law were only trampling on the blood of rams and goats and that held severe consequences. How much greater for trampling the blood of Christ.

I wonder if the Jews felt because of the annual sacrifice that their sins were covered in advance? The Jewish religious whom Jesus dealt with in scriptures seemed to be confident on their standing with God. I wonder if many take the sacrifice of Jesus a little too lightly as well. I am by no means perfect, but I sometimes hate that nature that I must daily fight against. I think Paul lets us know that he too struggled in the flesh.

Again I cannot draw lines, but it is a scary place to be as a Christian and to have willful sin. I think that blasphemy against the Holy Ghost is a line we can eventually cross by being presumptuous in our ways and overriding the work of the Spirit in our life. I don't think blasphemy against the Holy Ghost is a verbal offence although I wouldn't dare want Speak against the Spirit of God.

[jfrog]

Originally Posted by good samaritan

The writer of Hebrews 10 is comparing the severity of disobedience in Moses day according to the law with those in the church. The people in the law were only trampling on the blood of rams and goats and that held severe consequences. How much greater for trampling the blood of Christ.

I wonder if the Jews felt because of the annual sacrifice that their sins were covered in advance? The Jewish religious whom Jesus dealt with in scriptures seemed to be confident on their standing with God. I wonder if many take the sacrifice of Jesus a little too lightly as well. I am by no means perfect, but I sometimes hate that nature that I must daily fight against. I think Paul lets us know that he too struggled in the flesh.

Again I cannot draw lines, but it is a scary place to be as a Christian and to have willful sin. I think that blasphemy against the Holy Ghost is a line we can eventually cross by being presumptuous in our ways and overriding the work of the Spirit in our life. I don't think blasphemy against the Holy Ghost is a verbal offence although I wouldn't dare want Speak against the Spirit of God.

I've often wondered what sin isn't willful

[jfrog]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Hebrews 10:29 is speaking of blaspheming the Holy Ghost.

How much severer punishment do you think he will deserve who has trampled under foot the Son of God, and has regarded as unclean the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has INSULTED the Spirit of grace?

Regarded as unclean the blood of the covenant.

One the one side I stand and claim the blood of Jesus was clean and enough to cover all our sins.

On the other are all of you who claim that the blood of Jesus can't cover all sin

Who insults the spirit of grace?